BusTalk

[Q65A]

Many of you at BT3 know that I had lived in Queens, but Brooklyn actually is the borough where I was born, and where my family origins are. That said, here is a quiz about the history of NYCTA's Brooklyn Bus Division (and its predecessors). Good luck!
1.) How many different B19's were there, and where did they operate?
2.) Where did the B27 run?
3.) What features differentiated trolley-coaches #'s 3000-3099 from #'s
3100-3199?
4.) What easily noticeable feature on early NYCTA Brooklyn Division TDH-5301's was modified on subsequent orders for this bus from GM?
5.) When the BMT Myrtle Avenue El was demolished in 1969, what buses did the NYCTA Brooklyn Division acquire to help make service?
6.) What Brooklyn Division depot was closed in 1954 to make way for new highway construction? What highway was being constructed at that time?
7.) How many depots in the Brooklyn Division had serviced the trolley coach fleet?
8.) What were the first diesel transit buses bought new by the Board of Transportation?
9.) With what fare-control device were early Brooklyn buses equipped?
10.) What were the first buses purchased by the BMT for their subsidiary Brooklyn Bus Corporation?

[N4 Jamaica]

An attempt to answer question 9: Turnstiles may have existed on some Brooklyn buses prior to 1948. I recall nickel turnstiles on the Brooklyn PCC's, some Flatbush Avenue 6000's, and Comprehensive crosstown buses in Manhattan. The way the question is worded, I would not be surprised that turnstiles existed on some B&QT (or BMT) buses, but the details are for me to learn from you. The turnstiles on the PCC's had a clever sloped tube that returned the nickels within reach of the operator's right hand.
Many thanks for posting these questions.
Joe McMahon

[Mr. Linsky]

Bob,

Re; Question #6;

Could the 1954 construction that caused the demolition of a depot have been the Brooklyn Queens Expressway?

That's about the only one I can think of that might have been built at that time.

Mr. Linsky
"The Green Hornet"
Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica & Arverne, NY

[Mr. Linsky]

Bob,

Re; Question # 8;

Unless they were by another manufacturer that I can't think of the first Diesels bought by New York City Transit System (aka Board of Transportation) were 1948 GM TDH 4507's numbered 2000 to 2049 and delivered in January of that year.

Mr. Linsky
"The Green Hornet"
Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica & Arverne, NY

[B53RICH]

#4: The standee window frame was deleted over the front teardrop looking windows to give more structural support. The front end of the bus started to sag.

#5: During 1969? Then that would have to be the newlook Flx's with AC numbered 4000-4202. I remember 4100-4152 arrriving new to FP.
I'm having another thought about the TDH-5106's in the 2600 series from MABSTOA but I'm not sure if those were enough to help with the loss of the train service.

[BrooklynBus]

Question 1: I can think of only 1 B19 the Navy Yard route from the Williomsburg Savings Bank to the Navy Yard. There must have been one at least one more, probably in southern Brooklyn in the 1930s.

Question 2: B27 was Meeker Avenue route before it became B27/29 Meeker-Marcy.

[Free-transfer]

#1 B-19 Adelphi/Carlton 6/29/42 New Bus-BMT

#2 Just a guess, but I thought it ran near Mill Basin?
Somehow, I can also picture it passing Seaview Hospital.

#3 Reflective tape on the rear...for safety at night?

#4: Like B53 Rich said.... The standee window frame was deleted over the front teardrop looking windows. I also think the rear windows, which were 3 sections, became 4, with the split in the middle. Or was it the other way around?

#5 GM TH-5106 in the lower 7000 series?

#6 The Maspeth Depot (Brooklyn Division) on Grand avenue and 69th place was razed in 1952 for the 1954 construction of the LIE.

#7 No clue.

#8 Good question....NYC BOT didn't buy any Yellow Coach or GM's
(although they did take over companies with) before this order,
#2000-#2049 TDH4507 01/48 but, they did buy Twins for Brooklyn.
The questions...what Twins?

#9 Turnstyles installed behind the driver.

#10 Brooklyn Queens Transit Bus #1472, was The First Bus to Replace a
Trolley (Flushing-Ridgewood Line) and it was a Twin Coach!

[Q65A]

Here are the answers to this quiz, obtained from Motor Coach Age (June-July 1975):

1.) There actually were 3 different routes called B19. From 11/30/31-5/1/38, the B19 operated via Fresh Pond Rd. from Fresh Pond Rd. & Cornelia St. to Jamaica Ave. & Crescent St. From 6/29/42 to sometime in 1947, B19 ran via Flatbush Ave. & Tillary St. from Hanson Pl. & Flatbush Ave. to Navy & Concor Sts. Also from 6/29/42 until fairly recently, the B19 also ran via Carlton Ave. from Ashland Pl. & Hanson Pl. to Grand & Flushing Avenues.
2.) The B27 was the Fulton St. Shuttle; it ran via Fulton from Alabama Ave. to Elderts La. from 3/12/50 to 2/1/55.
3.) Trolley-coaches #'s 3000-3099 were built with GE electrical equipment, while #'s 3100-3199 were built with Westinghouse electrical equipment. Both groups were constructed by St. Louis Car Co., which was a major supplier of subway cars to the BOT and TA.
4.) Early NYCTA Brooklyn Division TDH-5301's were delivered with front destination signs that had small lines of lettering squeezed onto the center of the curtains; this feature was modified on subsequent orders to have large, more legible letters spread across the width of the sign curtains.
5.) When the BMT Myrtle Avenue El was demolished in 1969, the NYCTA Brooklyn Division acquired 85 retired TDH-5106’s from MABSTOA to help make service. These were selected from the 2600-2689 and 3222-3289 number series, were assigned to various depots in the Brooklyn Division, and were withdrawn from service in 1971 when new 4300-series T6H-5305A’s arrived from GM.
6.) Maspeth Depot was closed in 1954 to make way for construction of the new Long Island Expressway. Located at Brown Pl. & Grand Avenue, it had opened in 1907 as a BRT surface car house, was closed in 1937, then was reopened as a bus depot in 1948.
7.) Originally, two depots in the Brooklyn Division had serviced the trolley coach fleet: Bergen St. and Crosstown. In 1952, a major fire in Greenpoint damaged overhead wires near Crosstown Depot, and all trolley coaches were serviced thereafter only at Bergen St. until were withdrawn from service in 1960.
8.) The first diesel transit buses bought new by the Board of Transportation were 1941 Twin Coach Model 41-GDE’s (#’s 1300-1359). Believe it or not, these units were early hybrids of sorts: they came with Hercules diesel engines and have electric transmissions.
9.) Early Brooklyn buses were equipped with turnstiles.
10.) The first buses purchased by the BMT for their subsidiary Brooklyn Bus Corporation were 1924 Yellow Coach Type Z (Model Z-B-200)double deckers (#’s 100-109). Apparently, these were used more for charters than regular route service, and were sold to FACCO in 1929.

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