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Buses and the Puerto Rican Day Parade, then and now
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 4293
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hart Bus wrote:
NYO - It was an easy ID. I grew up on 43rd St and Queens Blvd and walked past that spot numerous times.


Hart Bus:

It pays to live in the right neighborhood....... Wink

"NYO"
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 4293
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 3:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Two quick questions:

When were the last MABSTOA Old Looks retired?

Where they all scrapped or were any sold to another operator?

Thanks in advance.....

"NYO"
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MaBSTOA 15



Age: 63
Joined: 27 Feb 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The MaBSTOA old looks were gone in the following order:

1965... GM TDH-4506 and TDH-4507
1966/1967... GM TDH- 4509; Mack C-49; GM TDH-4510 and TDH-5101 (ex-NYCTA)
1970... GM TDH-5106 and low number high mileage TDH-5301

Some of the TDH-5106 were transferred to NYCTA but did not last long.

Most of these buses were scrapped. Some early old looks became salt spreaders.
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MaBSTOA 15



Age: 63
Joined: 27 Feb 2013
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

New York Omnibus 2629...

Regarding the Oliver Ogden book...

Note that #2500 has "blackout lights"

Also, #2543 (page 97) is credited as a Fifth Avenue Coach it is actually a MaBSTOA bus. The Fifth Avenue name and legend are painted out and a MaBSTOA emblem appears between the side ad racks.

Also, an observation on the book. Great job but the pre-war coverage, specially the Queen Mary's becomes redundant. Post-war coverage starts out good but then dies. No pictures of the TDH-5106s!
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W.B. Fishbowl



Age: 50
Joined: 02 Oct 2014
Posts: 162
Location: New York, New York, USA

PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MaBSTOA 15 wrote:
The MaBSTOA old looks were gone in the following order:

1965... GM TDH-4506 and TDH-4507
1966/1967... GM TDH- 4509; Mack C-49; GM TDH-4510 and TDH-5101 (ex-NYCTA)
1970... GM TDH-5106 and low number high mileage TDH-5301

Some of the TDH-5106 were transferred to NYCTA but did not last long.

Most of these buses were scrapped. Some early old looks became salt spreaders.

I presume that therefore 1966/67 was when NYCO/FACL/MaBSTOA 2969 (a TDH-4509 built for NYCO in Nov-Dec 1950, and famous as the original "Jackie Gleason bus") was retired and sent to the crusher - was it upon the last of the 1965-66 order (6401-6900) or at the point the 1966-67 order (8301-8780) came in, with some of the buses from those orders assigned to 100th Street out of which 2969 was based for most if not all its service life?
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 4293
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MaBSTOA 15 wrote:
The MaBSTOA old looks were gone in the following order:

1965... GM TDH-4506 and TDH-4507
1966/1967... GM TDH- 4509; Mack C-49; GM TDH-4510 and TDH-5101 (ex-NYCTA)
1970... GM TDH-5106 and low number high mileage TDH-5301

Some of the TDH-5106 were transferred to NYCTA but did not last long.

Most of these buses were scrapped. Some early old looks became salt spreaders.


MaBSTOA 15:

This was just the data I was looking to get my hands on......thank you!

Sad that none were saved; it would seem that the NYCTA/MTA ditched their Old Looks much earlier than some other properties.

I know Baltimore's MTA still rostered some Old Looks into the early 1980's.

I totally concur on your book observations......you hit the nail right on the head.

Old Looks still survived (in rapidily declining numbers) into the 80's here in NJ; the very last were one or two running on the NHBL's #1 local, between JSQ and Nungessers (I grew up with NHBL's diverse roster, and still have many great memories)


"NYO"


Last edited by NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 on Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:09 pm; edited 1 time in total
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
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Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A retired square-window Old Look patiently awaiting "snow duty", 1971; note retired MACKS in the background.......

http://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?1415

(courtesy: bus.nycsubway.org)
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Hart Bus



Age: 67
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 23, 2017 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MaBSTOA 15 wrote:
New York Omnibus 2629...

Regarding the Oliver Ogden book...

Note that #2500 has "blackout lights"

Also, #2543 (page 97) is credited as a Fifth Avenue Coach it is actually a MaBSTOA bus. The Fifth Avenue name and legend are painted out and a MaBSTOA emblem appears between the side ad racks.

Also, an observation on the book. Great job but the pre-war coverage, specially the Queen Mary's becomes redundant. Post-war coverage starts out good but then dies. No pictures of the TDH-5106s!


Not such a great book in the opinion of myself and bus maven Eddie Crew because it has nothing on the strike that led to the city takeover. A monumental event in the history of FACC and not a mention in the book. Very disappoining
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 4293
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MaBSTOA 15 wrote:
New York Omnibus 2629...

Regarding the Oliver Ogden book...

Note that #2500 has "blackout lights"

Also, #2543 (page 97) is credited as a Fifth Avenue Coach it is actually a MaBSTOA bus. The Fifth Avenue name and legend are painted out and a MaBSTOA emblem appears between the side ad racks.

Also, an observation on the book. Great job but the pre-war coverage, specially the Queen Mary's becomes redundant. Post-war coverage starts out good but then dies. No pictures of the TDH-5106s!


MaBSTOA 15;

I still cannot understand why New Look coverage in Ogden's book was so miniscule; surely, he could have obtained enough 5th Avenue Coach New Look photos to create another chapter.

IMHO, the New Looks were clearly ignored....why, I have no idea; I really would have enjoyed seeing more photos showing New Looks.....

"NYO"
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 25, 2017 12:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All:

Just a thought:

I would love to see someone come out with a book dedicated SOLELY to buses operated 5th Avenue Coach, in a style similar to Guy E. Martin's book, which EACH type getting the proper coverage.....INCLUDING the New Looks........

"NYO"
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W.B. Fishbowl



Age: 50
Joined: 02 Oct 2014
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Location: New York, New York, USA

PostPosted: Sun Jun 25, 2017 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 wrote:
I still cannot understand why New Look coverage in Ogden's book was so miniscule; surely, he could have obtained enough 5th Avenue Coach New Look photos to create another chapter.

IMHO, the New Looks were clearly ignored....why, I have no idea; I really would have enjoyed seeing more photos showing New Looks.....

So would I. But from what I remember, when New Looks were first introduced in 1959-60, some corners didn't think too highly of them (thought them a bit hideous compared with the more prevalent Old Looks whether from GM or Mack), and this may've been reflected in the miniscule amount of pics taken of FACL and ST Fishbowls, especially in their original pre-'62 green and cream paint scheme. They were the first buses from that combine, when new, to have mylar roll signs from Transign which first went into business the same year the first New Looks were built. (By the time 3101-3215 were all reassigned to the Bronx by the mid-1960's - the bulk of which photos of which fleet are what are floating around the web today - they were replaced with traditional cloth roll signs.)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




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PostPosted: Sun Jun 25, 2017 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

W.B:

Good points....and you might be right.

I recall reading somewhere long ago that, in Dayton, Ohio, the brand-new New Looks were so startling to the public (early 1960's) that their windshield's lower portions were actually covered over in opaque glass, to restore "proper modesty" to the city's public transit vehicles!

Perhaps, to some, the New Looks were thought to be too "avante garde" to be rumbling along swank 5th Avenue........

"NYO"
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W.B. Fishbowl



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PostPosted: Sun Jun 25, 2017 8:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The other thing: The "old looks" were still yuuuuge in number compared to the "New Looks" on the block. So it was a matter of numbers as well as the not-so-positive initial reaction.
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
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Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

W.B. Fishbowl wrote:
The other thing: The "old looks" were still yuuuuge in number compared to the "New Looks" on the block. So it was a matter of numbers as well as the not-so-positive initial reaction.


W.B.:

That would seem to make sense.

Too, recall that, at that time, MACKS, WHITES, and BRILLS were still commonplace in many cities; perhaps the bus enthusiasts back then wanted to aim their cameras at the more "traditional" buses that were then in operation, in New York and elsewhere.....

"NYO"
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MaBSTOA 15



Age: 63
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2017 7:15 pm    Post subject: Regarding the Fifth Avenue Coach New Looks... Reply with quote

Fifth Avenue Coach thought very highly of their GM "New Look" buses, they even used them on the cover of their 1959 Annual Report.

The artists rendition I assume is because the buses had not yet arrived.



ANNUAL REPORT 1959.jpg
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ANNUAL REPORT 1959.jpg


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