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Mr. Linsky BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 5071 Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.
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Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 1:55 am Post subject: 'VINTAGE WESTCHESTER SURFACE WAYS, INC. (NY)' |
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Seen in 1958 at its Mount Vernon, New York garage is fleet # 240 - a 1942 Mack Model 'Improved' (the improvement being the angled windshield) RB-3G and one of two likenesses delivered to Westchester Surface Ways, Inc.
The 27 passenger 'RB' series was a Mack medium duty offering and was powered by a 154 cubic inch 116 hp gasoline engine coupled to a 3 speed mechanical transmission and was perfect for low volume and feeder routes with 172 examples sold between 1941 and 1942.
The history of Westchester Surface Ways is sketchy at best but it is known that company took over four abandoned Mount Vernon routes of the South Westchester Bus Company sometime in late 1929 and, while operating in the midst of Third Avenue Railway territory, was never sought by that conglomerate as an affiliate.
Mack records show the purchase of only five buses including the RB's listed above and three 1938 6-CW-3S's with only used equipment procured post war.
A freshly painted # 240 is signed for the #3 line between Mount Vernon and the Dyre Avenue subway station at the New York City line.
Of note is the so familiar (to us older guys) cold war oriented Civil Defense decal just under the left head lamp indicating that the company was a participant in periodic drills and at readiness in the event enemy attack.
Photo courtesy of Vintage-Vault75 and is up for bid on eBay as item #
170912423997.
Mr. Linsky - Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, New York
![](http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa193/MISTERLINSKY/BUSESINC2/AWESTCHESTERSURFWAYS240_zpsc52e4d45.jpg)
Last edited by Mr. Linsky on Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:13 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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RailBus63 Moderator
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 1063
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Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2012 9:20 am Post subject: |
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What a great photo. I love seeing those ads - "7-Up - Makes Food Taste Better" - LOL! And who would have thought that we'd be nostalgic for the time when one could earn a whopping 3 percent on their savings account?
Thanks for sharing this.
Jim |
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Mr. Linsky BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 5071 Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.
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Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 3:20 pm Post subject: |
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Not to take headliner status away from Westchester Surface Ways # 240 above, but I have recreated this thread to also highlight the olio or hodgepodge of coaches that the company ran in their post war years.
Pictured sometime during the winter of 1959 and somewhere within the environs of Mount Vernon, New York is fleet # 602 - a 1944 GM Coach Model TG 4006 and another of the many used buses seen along the lines of this tiny Westchester County firm.
While the pedigree of # 602 is unknown to me, I had thought that it might have originally been one of twenty-nine purchased by Trenton Transit Company (NJ) and numbered 600 to 628 but the six of these buses that Trenton sold to Triboro Coach (NY) had no motorized ventilators on their roofs and # 602 in the photo does.
Only built in 1944 and under authority of Office of Defense Transportation (ODT), the TG 4006's, of which as few as 290 were produced, were fabricated in steel panels instead of then vital aluminum, had either painted steel or wooden passenger hand rails and seat backs in lieu of stainless steel and no exterior bright work.
Of note on # 602 are both the double front bumpers and double 'side swipe' moldings which afforded greater protection for the thinner sheet metal.
Photo courtesy of Vintage-Vault75 and is up for bid on eBay as item # 170912425210.
Mr. Linsky - Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, New York
![](http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa193/MISTERLINSKY/BUSESINC2/AWESTCHESTERSURFWAYS60244TG4006_zps319d24b9.jpg) |
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Mr. Linsky BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 5071 Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.
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Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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For those of you who may be keeping score on Westchester Surface Ways, Inc. (WSW) of Mount Vernon, New York, here are a couple of their post war Macks which is almost all I know about them so this report will be making a number of assumptions (and you know what can happen when you assume!).
By window count, # 452 and 453 pictured are either C-45's or C-47's probably circa late 40's or early 50's and, according to the manufacturer, were not purchased new by WSW.
WSW did buy some used Macks from Long Island's Hempstead Bus Corporation that had rare (for a Mack) after market directional signals but not set exactly as seen below and, on the premise that WSW maintained their original fleet numbers, I find no match at Mack.
By the license plate numbers, it's obvious that both buses were bought together but are not precisely alike as noted by their different front destination sign configurations, forward doors and under windshield treatments.
The location of this 1958 image may be at a railroad station as evidenced by the tracks along side the buses and the pedestrian access stairways from the roadway above.
Further information is welcomed.
Photo courtesy of Vintage-Vault75 and is up for bid on eBay as item # 170923046439.
Mr. Linsky - Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, New York
![](http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa193/MISTERLINSKY/BUSESINC2/AWSW452453MACKS.jpg) |
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N4 Jamaica
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 858 Location: Long Island
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Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:34 am Post subject: |
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My guess of the location of WSW 452 and 453 is East 241 Street, The Bronx. The view is towards the west, as the Wakefield Harlem Line station in the background here runs at a northeast angle. The station is still active. The two tracks in the foreground, with neither catenary nor 3rd rail seem to be a freight siding. The area is now a paved parking lot.
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Of some interest: the northern border of the City of New York takes some strange zig-zags near East 241st Street. To the north is the city of Mount Vernon. To the west of the original flow of the Bronx River is the city of Yonkers. The Bronx River (now a bit straighter than in the past) lies between the Bronx River Parkway (in Yonkers) and Metro-North's Harlem Line. A look at a Hagstrom Map will show how strangely the northern border of the City of New York swirls about this area. |
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frankie
Age: 77 Joined: 01 Feb 2011 Posts: 747 Location: St. Peters, Mo.
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Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 1:04 pm Post subject: |
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I may be wrong, but I think Mack 452 was made between 1945-47 as the squared bottom standee windows were used doing these years before being redesigned with round bottoms as with bus 453.
Frankie |
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Mr. Linsky BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 5071 Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.
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Posted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 1:29 pm Post subject: |
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N4 Jamaica & frankie,
Excellent observations and thank you for sharing.
Regards,
Mr. 'L' |
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Mr. Linsky BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 5071 Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.
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Posted: Sun Oct 14, 2012 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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I just love Westchester Surface Ways (WSW) because it was a virtually unheralded little bus line in southern Westchester County, New York running a potpourri of the most interesting and colorful second hand coaches.
It's the early sixties when you could still 'put a tiger in your tank' at Esso's 'Happy Motoring' sign and reminders of the raging cold war dominated the scene (billboard at right of frame) as we see WSW fleet number 446 - a Mack Model C-37 (GT or DT?) nearing the intersection of South Columbus Avenue and Fulton Lane as it passes Mount Vernon's famous Embassy Diner at lunch time.
It's difficult to say exactly where # 446 started life but it was probably not with another local operator as evidenced by the lack of intakes for the New York required motorized ventilation system.
Photo courtesy of Vintage-Vault75 and is up for bid on eBay as item # 180994068442.
Mr. Linsky - Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, New York
![](http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa193/MISTERLINSKY/BUSESINC2/AWSW446.jpg) |
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Mr. Linsky BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 5071 Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.
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Posted: Fri Nov 02, 2012 2:40 pm Post subject: |
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Adding to our Westchester Surface Ways, Inc. stable of an unusual collection of buses, we see fleet # 318 - a 1939 Mack Model 'CO' and one of an unknown number of likenesses (if any) operating for this small Mount Vernon, New York property.
The tough little heavy duty 36 passenger model CO, a shorter version of the very popular model CM, was powered by a 611 cubic inch, 160 hp. gasoline engine coupled to a three speed mechanical transmission and featured an 'air clutch' which eliminated the clutch pedal giving the passengers a 'jolt free' smooth ride.
For some unknown reason (at least to this writer), Mack located the windshield wiper transmissions out side the body and only did so on the CO models.
# 318 is seen sometime in the early fifties passing Fourth Avenue and heading for 'The Creek' which was one of its four lines radiating from the City of Mount Vernon.
Of note on # 318 are the fresh air intake vents to either side of the destination sign associated with a New York required full time mechanical ventilation system.
Photo courtesy of 'Vintage-Vault75' and is up for bid on eBay as item # 170934679128.
Mr. Linsky - Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, New York
![](http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa193/MISTERLINSKY/BUSESINC2/AWSW318MACKMODELCO.jpg) |
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Mr. Linsky BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 5071 Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.
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Posted: Sat Nov 03, 2012 3:46 pm Post subject: |
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Reconstructed report
The 1963 image below taken at the company's Garden Avenue garage and yard in Mount Vernon, New York should give you some better idea of the 'motley' fleet of buses that Westchester Street Transportation (WST) operated (no relation to Westchester Surface Ways).
A close look will reveal that most everything is used with many ex Fifth Avenue GM Coaches orphaned in the 1962 condemnation of that company's New York City operations along with Macks from its Surface Transit affiliate.
All be them faded, you can still discern the 'Go The Motor Coach Way' and 'Ride The Surface Way' slogans written across their roofs just over the passenger windows.
WST continued to operate as an affiliate of Fifth Avenue Coach Lines of Westchester until 1969 when it was sold to Liberty Lines.
Photo courtesy of 'Vintage-Vault75' and is up for bid on eBay as item # 181015459758.
Mr. Linsky - Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, New York
![](http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa193/MISTERLINSKY/BUSESINC2/AWSWGARDENAVYARDMTVERNON.jpg)
Last edited by Mr. Linsky on Sun Nov 04, 2012 2:31 am; edited 2 times in total |
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N4 Jamaica
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 858 Location: Long Island
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Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2012 2:04 am Post subject: |
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Reluctantly, I suggest that the Garden Avenue depot was not Westchester Surface Ways, but Westchester Street Transportation. In the foreground is the long-standing maintenance barn of the Third Avenue Railway's subsidiary, which in the late 1940's hosted two routes, A and B. (I forget the company name on the transfers.) When replaced by buses, it was Westchester Street Transportation (also a TARS subsidiary) that did the routes. Maybe three tracks entered the carbarn, while most of the streetcars were stored outdoors. Unfortunately, to the right was the burn track, where, once stripped, the TARS cars from Manhattan and The Bronx were tipped and set afire. One afternoon, 1948 or so, Dad brought me here and we scavenged a Bronx destination roller sign, which we brought home, unrolled and cleaned.
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In the background can be seen a soda distribution plant and the Hutchinson River Parkway. The streetcars and buses ran along East Sandford Boulevard (to the left). Garden Avenue, not used by transit, was the intersecting street coming from the north and facing the carbarn entrance. Bee Line route 42, the successor to the A car, passes by on Sandford Boulevard, from the Interborough East 241 Street station to New Rochelle. Someplace along here there may have been a second fare zone, later eliminated. A multi-level shopping mall, including Target, now stands on the transit property.
Many thanks for posting the photo.
Joe McMahon |
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Mr. Linsky BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 5071 Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.
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Posted: Sun Nov 04, 2012 2:16 am Post subject: |
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N4 Jamaica,
I think you're 100% right on the location - unfortunately, I went with the caption that accompanied the photo.
I should have remembered seeing WST buses out of Garden Avenue in MCA a while back.
Interesting photo anyway - no great shakes!
Regards,
Mr. 'L'
Brentwood, Ca. office |
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Mr. Linsky BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 5071 Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.
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Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2012 4:59 pm Post subject: |
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For those who are rostering the equipment of Westchester Surface Ways, Inc. of Mount Vernon, New York, behold the attachment - fleet # 273 - a 1952 Mack Model C-45-DT shown outside the company's Oak Street garage in September of 1968.
If # 273 seems familiar to you Long Islanders, it might be because it's ex Hempstead Bus Corporation # 273 and one of three known likenesses including #'s 275 and 278 that went north to Westchester.
Interestingly, production records show that Hempstead Bus bought twenty-eight new Macks between 1948 and 1952 numbered 241 to 248, 251 to 260 and 261 to 270 but indicates nothing for 273, 275 and 278 which brings me to conclude that they were purchased used.
Of note on # 273 are the set of Michigan Markers over the destination sign (extremely rare on standard post war Macks) and Hempstead's flag painted out in black under the belt line amidships.
Photo courtesy of 'ttcbeat' and has been sold on eBay.
Mr. Linsky - Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, New York
![](http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa193/MISTERLINSKY/BUSESINC2/AWSW273EXHEMPSTEADBUS.jpg) |
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Mr. Linsky BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 5071 Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.
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Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:40 pm Post subject: |
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Adding another bus to the 'crazy quilt' collection of used equipment operated by the tiny Westchester Surface Ways, Inc. (WSW) of Mount Vernon, New York, we see fleet # 502 - a 1951 Mack Model C-45-DT.
# 502 was originally one of twenty likenesses numbered 500 to 519 purchased new by Bee Line, Inc. of Rockville Centre, New York.
In its unchanged Bee Line livery, # 502 is shown sometime in 1964 at the Dyre Avenue subway station in the Eastchester section of The Bronx readying to return to Mount Vernon on WSW's # 2 route.
Of note on # 502 are the replacement directional signals under the originals which were deemed as inadequate by the Public Service Commission in the mid fifties.
Photo courtesy of 'Vintage-Vault75' and is up for bid on eBay as item # 181044656976.
Mr. Linsky - Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, New York
![](http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa193/MISTERLINSKY/BUSESINC2/AWSW502EXBEELINE.jpg) |
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Mr. Linsky BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007 Posts: 5071 Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.
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Posted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 3:51 pm Post subject: |
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There is much evidence to show that many New York City Transit Authority pre New Look G.M. coaches were eventually sold off to enjoy second lives with various metropolitan area private companies.
However, not until I found the attached photo did I know of many (if any) city Macks that went in that same direction.
Pictured in 1958 at the Westchester Surface Ways facility in Mount Vernon, New York is fleet # 5078 - a 1948 Mack Model C-45-DT originally purchased as part of an order for 115 likenesses numbered from 5000 to 5114 by the City of New York Board of Transportation with most being assigned to the newly acquired Manhattan routes of the East Side and Comprehensive Omnibus Corporations.
Interestingly, these buses, which were diverted to the city while still in pipeline, were to have gone to Surface Transportation System for their Yonkers operation but were lost by default in payments to Mack.
Obviously already re-registered to Westchester with a brand new set of license plates, # 5078 is seen still in full city regalia including its M-15/Second Avenue signage and probably being backed into the garage to have its flag changed (that's about all that WSW did with acquired equipment in later years - paint jobs were out of the question!).
I wonder where the blue back wheel came from?
Photo courtesy of 'Vintage-Vault75' and is up for bid on eBay as item # 181044658380.
Mr. Linsky - Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, New York
![](http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa193/MISTERLINSKY/BUSESINC2/AWSW5078EXNYC.jpg) |
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