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'HERE'S A CORGI MISTAKE!'

 
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Mr. Linsky
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 5071
Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.

PostPosted: Tue Oct 19, 2010 3:18 pm    Post subject: 'HERE'S A CORGI MISTAKE!' Reply with quote

Corgi lists the attached model of Madison Avenue Coach Company # 1707 as a GM TDH 4507 - very wrong!;

While Corgi's GM Old Look designs were nothing to write home about (especially the rear treatment) their coloring and livery schemes were about near perfect as can be seen in the comparison between the model and the real 1707 below.

However, everything else here is haywire starting with the fact that the bus, which is a model of a TD 4506, shows both front and rear bumpers from the later paired window version, no roof mounted ventilation systems and no screened engine hatches among other things.

Now, I know that for what Corgi gets for these models (about $39 or so) you really can't expect miracles but this one is a little ridiculous - even my Corgi Green Line 4507 has more accurate detail.

On a scale of one to ten with ten being the best I would rate it as a six or seven at the most and it would probably make a decent addition to a less discriminating collector's shelf.

Regards,

Mr. 'L'




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fishbowl



Age: 70
Joined: 01 Sep 2010
Posts: 62
Location: Detroit

PostPosted: Wed Oct 20, 2010 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't get me started on Corgi inaccuracies! Growing up in Chicago, I have a special bone to pick with their old look Chicago Motor Coach.

Their model of #1165:


The real #1166 (or so I was lead to believe from the caption on this photo):


Therefore, it looks like Corgi used the wrong livery for #1165 (unless one fleet number lower was different)! The only example of Corgi's livery I could find on a Chicago Motor Coach bus was on this Yellow Coach #846 (from a brochure):


Something ain't right here. Could Corgi have acutally mixed up bus models and liveries? What am I missing??
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Mr. Linsky
BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee



Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 5071
Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.

PostPosted: Wed Oct 20, 2010 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not too familiar with Omnibus's Chicago operation except that it has always looked as though their liveries usually followed those of New York as part of their master plan.

And, there are those 4509 bumpers on a 4506 again.

It would appear to me that in this case Corgi really got mixed up - what they needed in their design studio was a technical adviser but, from all accounts, I don't think they cared!

The front end of the Model 1165 doesn't even really resemble a GM Old Look at all!

It's a shame.

Regards,

Mr. 'L'
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Hart Bus



Age: 68
Joined: 24 Apr 2007
Posts: 1122

PostPosted: Wed Oct 20, 2010 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what little information I have gathered from other boards, Corgi is a British company, designing them from pictures and they only choose to consult with one or two hobbyists in the USA. Adding to the problem is that the buses are manufactured in China.

A lot gets lost in the translation.

However since there are so few of us, what other company would be willing to jump into such a small market. Unfortunately, we beggars cannot be choosers.
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fishbowl



Age: 70
Joined: 01 Sep 2010
Posts: 62
Location: Detroit

PostPosted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 9:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a larger pic of Chicago Motor Coach 1166... just to prove that it really is 1166 (you can actually read the number on this one) and that Corgi was wrong when it chose the older, Yellow Coach livery for its model of 1165.

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fishbowl



Age: 70
Joined: 01 Sep 2010
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Location: Detroit

PostPosted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh... and here's another shot of Yellow Coach 846 in the livery Corgi chose for its TDH-4506:

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Mr. Linsky
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 5071
Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.

PostPosted: Sat Oct 30, 2010 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wrote the following as a comment on the attached Chicago color photo from the Jim Husing collection at Eddie's Rail Fan Page recently;

BTW; CMC # 1166 shown above is a 1940 Yellow Coach Model TD 4502


"Pictured above on a sunny fall day in 1953, we see fleet # 1369 - a 1945 GM Coach Model TD 4506 and one of 195 numbered between 1205 and 1399 delivered in increments to the Chicago Motor Coach Company division of the Omnibus Corporation between mid 1945 and late 1946.

The Diesel powered 44 passenger 4506's were among the very first GM buses produced at the end of World War II and were devoid of both interior and exterior bright work, with wooden or painted metal passenger railings and seat backs substituted for stainless steel.

Arriving in basic gun metal gray as per government order, Chicago's shops applied the ornate two tone green and cream paint scheme that was trademark for both the Chicago and New York Omnibus Corporation subsidiaries.

The 4506 was a reliable coach and the hundreds that served the New York market did so well into the early sixties".

Regards,

Mr. Linsky - Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, New York

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fishbowl



Age: 70
Joined: 01 Sep 2010
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Location: Detroit

PostPosted: Sun Oct 31, 2010 8:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr. Linsky wrote:
CMC # 1166 shown above is a 1940 Yellow Coach Model TD 4502

As always, thanks for your clarification(s).

Incidentally, Corgi labels its CMC 1165 a "GM4505," gives it wing mirrors and a Yellow Coach front emblem. Now I'm really confused!
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Mr. Linsky
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007
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Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.

PostPosted: Sun Oct 31, 2010 1:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

F.B.,


Corgi ought to check the Ohio Museum before they start dating and identifying the models they make.

As seen under the TD 4502 list;

0180-0204 Chicago Motor Coach Co (Chicago IL) 1145-1169 12/40

Regards,

Mr. 'L'
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NormR



Age: 71
Joined: 30 Nov 2010
Posts: 5
Location: Naperville, Illinois

PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 3:05 pm    Post subject: Corgi Was Correct. Bus Models Reply with quote

The Corgi model of the Chicago Motor Coach, Model TD4502 was painted correct. The paint design was used for the 24 buses recieived in 1940, and the 34 TD4505 buses received in 1942. These buses were mainly used on the west side #31 Washington Blvd. and #26 Jackson route. There is a photo of unit 1156 in this paint design on page 24 of the March1972 issue of Motor Coach Age, which featured the Chicago Motor Coach Co. These buses were re-painted after WW2 in the more familar Omnibus design.

I will eventually scan this picture.

NormR
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timecruncher



Age: 67
Joined: 23 Dec 2008
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Location: Louisville, Kentucky

PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, the color scheme is dead-on to Louisville Railway's scheme applied to its TD4006, TDH4007, TDH4507, TDH5103, White 743 and repainted on its postwar Mack C41DT models. Really close.

In the late forties, Louisville Rwy was owned by a syndicate that may have had interest in Chicago Motor Coach. That or it was a 'factory' paint job and GM figured nobody would notice.

timecruncher
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fishbowl



Age: 70
Joined: 01 Sep 2010
Posts: 62
Location: Detroit

PostPosted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 5:22 pm    Post subject: Glad Corgi got it right. Reply with quote

NormR wrote:
The Corgi model of the Chicago Motor Coach, Model TD4502 was painted correct. The paint design was used for the 24 buses recieived in 1940, and the 34 TD4505 buses received in 1942. These buses were mainly used on the west side #31 Washington Blvd. and #26 Jackson route. There is a photo of unit 1156 in this paint design on page 24 of the March1972 issue of Motor Coach Age, which featured the Chicago Motor Coach Co. These buses were re-painted after WW2 in the more familar Omnibus design. NormR


Thanks, Norm, for clearing that up, and I look forward to seeing your scan of #1156. Corgi may have been wrong about its old look CMC being a 4505 (as Mr. L points out, it's a 4502 from 1940), but it seems to have been correct, after all, about the livery and the Route #26 Jackson signage.

I've never seen these buses in anything but the familiar Ominbus "wing" livery (as shown in my photo of #1166), but I confess I've also never seen them as they were originally delivered. It's good to know that Corgi got it right.
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