BusTalk

Mr. Linsky

I see by the clock that Turkey Time is over around the rest of the country and I'm hoping that you're all not too overstuffed to get back to work! - so here we go;

You'll have to bear with me on this one because I don't have an awful lot of information.

Pictured below and trundling alongside New Orleans' famous St Charles streetcar line is fleet number 4564 - a second generation GM 5300 series signed as 'New Orleans Tours'.

What makes this bus so special, of course, is its extreme makeover including a completely changed side window and door design as well as a front face lift doing away with the traditional New Look accouterments under the windshield and adding just sets of post 1974 rectangular headlight units.

The Fleur-de-lis pattern between the headlights could be the company logo or just an after thought.

My concern is the history of GM New Look roof shimmy and what affect would ensue by removing what little roof support there was in order to install all that glass.

Photo borrowed for educational purposes only.

Mr. Linsky - Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, NY

HwyHaulier · Joined: 16 Dec 2007 Posts: 932 Location: Harford County, MD

Mr. 'L' -

Beats me why some shop took on all that aggravation!

Note in the photo, by the reflected light, the side glazing was no such thing! Spot the play of the light, reflected off
somewhat convex surfaces. So, whoever did the rebuild likely knew about the problems, result of loading of the roof.
That is, side windows appear to have been a plastic product (Lexan?)...

................Vern................

timecruncher · Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 10:36 am Post subject:

Wow.

And I thought a GM newlook re-do couldn't look much worse than the ones out at the Grand Canyon:

These are part of the Enterra fleet used generally for the canyon rim tours that meet the daily passenger train from Williams, AZ. They all seem to be 8V-71 equipped suburbans with V730 trannies and parcel racks and [very cramped] reclining seats -- don't know the heritage, but I'd bet that most are west-coast units, since the outfit that did these conversions was based in Phoenix, if I am not mistaken.

New Flyer CNG low floor coaches are used for Grand Canyon park shuttles. Meh...

timecruncher

HwyHaulier · Joined: 16 Dec 2007 Posts: 932 Location: Harford County, MD

timecruncher -

Hart Bus · Age: 74 Joined: 24 Apr 2007 Posts: 1150

Let me make some comments about all the buses shown .

1 - The New Orleans Fishbowl, may have had the windows redone so that the passengers can see more of the sights on narrow streets. The windows remind of some of the windows on Prevost Marathons.

2 - The Grand Canyon "Frankenbus" is clearly a fishbowl front and an RTS rear, with windows similar to LAMTA RTS's. Unless they are MCI Classic Windows. The 'bowl' front is probably to get more of the sights into the eyes of the passengers.

Alan ARon

timecruncher · Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 1:39 pm Post subject:

'Frankenbus' -- I like that.

I don't recall the name of the west-coast outfit that specialized in the "upgrade" of GM new look coaches, but they had at least a few demonstrators at one time and I seem to recall seeing one at the APTA Expo many years ago.

There was one here in Louisville for a while, built out of what was once a 4519/4521/4523 body. Never took a photo because it was so ugly.

The side panels are of GM Classic design, as is the rear end. The idea was to provide an inexpensive upgrade/rebuild to conventional transit buses rather than paying double to actually replace them. This was a scheme hatched in the years before California had ample transit funding and everyone was scrambling to acquire equipment.

Of course, this is moot now, since the guvernator has illegally taken much of the dedicated transit funding in California to use for other social agendas.

The largest state in the country (and what? -- the third or fourth largest economy on the earth), is teetering on fiscal collapse because its politicians are hell-bent on spending three or more times what the state has in resources on every idiot social program possible. This is the mindset that our bonehead speaker of the house comes from.

*Ahem*

Sorry 'bout that. Got 'fired up for a moment...

Anyway, the rebuild never really caught on, and what you see at the Grand Canyon is pretty much the entire production of 40-foot, 96-inch transit suburbans that were converted. These guys are at least 25-30 years old, and except for being made ugly, are still GM transit coaches on the inside.

The earlier photos were from 2004 and 2005, respectively. At that time, at least one of these creatures had been repainted:

Shown here blocking the view of an ex-Northern Pacific Budd dome coach.

timecruncher

timecruncher · Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 1:59 pm Post subject: Grand Canyon park shuttles

*yawn* New Flyer low floor CNG coaches make up the regular loop shuttle routes that ply between Canyon Village and east rim locations:

They're set up city transit-style inside, without fareboxes. Your admission to the National Park includes a transit fee, and driving within the park is heavily restricted. Unless you're staying at Bright Angel Lodge, you pretty much have to stay around the cabins or at the perimiter park & ride lots. These routes stay crowded, but run at fairly frequent intervals. They are also run by Anterra/Harveycar, or whoever the current park vendor is.

And slow as Christmas! I would guess it is a combination of CNG fuel and high altitude that contributes to slow performance. With standees on board, I thought the poor guy would never get the bus rolling that I was on.

I have visited during April for the past few years, prior to attending the Trapeze Software User's Conference in Phoenix or Tuscon in recent years, and the park is packed even on weekdays, with many foreign visitors.

If any of you get out that way with or without family to see the big hole, I strongly suggest you use the train from Williams. Train fare includes admission to the park, entertainment on board, a hokey 'mellerdrama' prior to boarding in Williams and an annoying 'train robbery' on the return.

Alas, Anterra owns the railroad operation now and has axed steam operation during the Summer due to fuel and maintenance costs. But then, where else can you ride a 15-car passenger train pulled by classic Alco cab units, Budd domes and an open-platform obs today?

Mr. Linsky · Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 2:15 pm Post subject:

If you'll permit me, I'll put a little better light on this Grand Canyon job so we can see more detail.

This is a very pleasant looking conversion - I particularly like the updated headlight treatment and the 'Classic' like passenger windows.

I will admit that an RTS rear clip is something new to me but that doesn't look bad either.

On a scale of one to ten, I'd give it about a nine!

Good photos.

Mr. 'L'

Hart Bus · Age: 74 Joined: 24 Apr 2007 Posts: 1150

To timecruncher--- I'm glad you like the nickname "Frankkenbus", however it was not my creation. It was given to an GM Old Look that has a Fishbowl front. I downloaded it to my computer, but can't open it up. To all who are computer literate, the icon is a rectangle with six items inside. I think its in a bmp format and I don't know how to either change it or open it.

As far as the tour buses. I would have preferred that they kept the fishbowl headllights, rather than the two squares, that look like there from motor homes.

Mr. Linsky · Posted: Sat Nov 28, 2009 5:04 pm Post subject:

ECA,

When I get a bmp format (whatever that means) photo in my Picture Manager I send it to Photobucket and they will automatically change it to jpg format (whatever that means) and then I'm able to move it around at will.

I wish I could tell you more but I'm ignorant when it comes the fine details of picture transfer.

Regards.

WCA

ripta42 · Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 8:21 am Post subject:

ripta42 · Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 8:26 am Post subject:

timecruncher · Posted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 3:42 pm Post subject:

That's it! I couldn't recall the name off the top of my head, because the attempt for an "inexpensive upgrade" was weak at best and not taken seriously by most transit operators.

Ahh, I'd love to have around 200 Classics with Sutrak a/c, Cummins ISL engines and decent transit seats for our routes here in Louisville. Painted silver, with the new color scheme...

Instead, I have Gillig low floors and a few very tired Flxibles!

timecruncher

spiker97 · Joined: 30 Nov 2008 Posts: 2

There were also some of these Midwest Bus Rebuilders Phoenix rebuilds that were operating somewhere in Virginia as well. I believe at some point of time one demonstrated on GRTC. Whether they were interested or not is unknown.

There also was a Canadian entry into this called the Alouette, which also converted a traditional GM fishbowl into a mutation of a Classic. I don't think they did a lot of them, but I know there were operators in Quebec that did get some.

That GM old look with a fishbowl front must have been interesting. Knowing that there also were companies that rebuilt GM old looks and modernized them {there was a company based in Apollo PA that operated some but I would have to find the slides to remember the name} it's scary what you could have come up with, especially to modernize and make older coaches compliant to modern standards. Or semi-modern, anyway...

ripta42 · Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 11:13 pm Post subject:

Was the Alouette a DuponTrolley product? They've done interesting things with Classics (Cartier), RTSes (Victoria), and even MCIs and Nova LFSes...

http://www.busfanplace.com/rech_builder.php?lang=en&id=Dupont_Industries

Here are photos of the GM New Look/Old Look:

http://www.chbmbus.org/0001.htm

There is also a Flxible Old Look with a New Look front end, delivered to CTA in 1960 and still part of their historic fleet.