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MTA-LI Bus Update
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d.marra



Age: 86
Joined: 23 Jun 2008
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 4:48 pm    Post subject: MTA-LI Bus Update Reply with quote

On Friday Jan 9th, there were MTA and Nassau County officials at the LI Bus oka MSBA Depot in Garden City.
Nassau County Executive Tom Souzzi told MTA officials, any new buses ordered by MTA for Nassau County will have Orange striping, or will not run on LI Bus routes!!
When Nassau County took over the counties private lines in 1973, as ATU 1061 Safety member, I was directly involved in some of the issues involving our drivers and equipment.
Ralph Caso, then Nassau Cnty Exec, added a Clause into the charter that all the county owned and operated buses, would display orange and blue striping, same colors of Nassau's Police Cars and other county vehicles.
I believe that charter is still in effect?
There are a few logical reasons why that clause was added to the original charter.
That is the reason only one bus has the NYC blue striping, and only one demo is on the property. Glad someone is paying attention.
Btw, oka=officially known as. MSBA is The Official name of MTA LI Bus.
Long Island Bus was a school bus company bought out by Schenck Transportation in the early 1960's. The company that still owns the Schenck name, also holds rights to all the names Schenck owned.

Daniel
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upperharlemline4ever




Joined: 26 Oct 2007
Posts: 60
Location: New York State

PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saw an Orion VII (low floor) on the shoulder of I-287 in White Plains heading towards I-95 the other day. It was labeled LI Bus and had only an MTA blue stripe, no orange. Considering Nassau County is paying very little towards the operation, leaving others in the MTA service district to pay, why should they have much to say about the paint scheme of the buses?
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S-60 To Smith Haven Mall




Joined: 29 Nov 2007
Posts: 1723
Location: Suffolk County, NY

PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

upperharlemline4ever wrote:
Saw an Orion VII (low floor) on the shoulder of I-287 in White Plains heading towards I-95 the other day. It was labeled LI Bus and had only an MTA blue stripe, no orange. Considering Nassau County is paying very little towards the operation, leaving others in the MTA service district to pay, why should they have much to say about the paint scheme of the buses?


because no matter how much Nassau is paying the MTA, the MTA still signed a contract with Nassau to operate their buses and there for has to do what ever Nassau said in the Contract the MTA signed.
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RailBus63
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 1063

PostPosted: Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nassau County's lack of support for LI Bus has annoyed me for some time, but that being said, I hope they prevail in the paint scheme dispute. There is a precedent for this - Metro-North and Long Island Rail Road operate M-7's in two different paint schemes, and the Connecticut Department of Transportation has specified red striping on its commuter cars instead of MTA/Metro North's usual blue.
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N4 Jamaica




Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 658
Location: Long Island

PostPosted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd have to check a lot of dates, but please note that the orange dates back to the year 1544 when the houses of Orange and Nassau were merged (as I recall by marriage, but this wikipedia article says something else).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orange,_Vaucluse
Nassau is a town in the Lahn Valley in Germany.
The merged house of Orange-Nassau became dominant in the Netherlands, and around the 1680's the Brits named Long Island Nassau (briefly) after William III, king of England, who was of the house of Orange-Nassau. The blue is Nassau, the orange Orange. This is the same house of Orange that is given so much prominence in Northern Ireland's Orangemen parades. Queens County included Mineola and what is now Nassau until a year after the formation of Greater New York. They fished around for a name for the new county and came up with Nassau, again taking the colors Blue (for Nassau) and Orange (for Orange). Hence the stripe on the police cars and buses.
Joe McMahon
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S-60 To Smith Haven Mall




Joined: 29 Nov 2007
Posts: 1723
Location: Suffolk County, NY

PostPosted: Sun Jan 11, 2009 9:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

N4 Jamaica wrote:
I'd have to check a lot of dates, but please note that the orange dates back to the year 1544 when the houses of Orange and Nassau were merged (as I recall by marriage, but this wikipedia article says something else).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orange,_Vaucluse
Nassau is a town in the Lahn Valley in Germany.
The merged house of Orange-Nassau became dominant in the Netherlands, and around the 1680's the Brits named Long Island Nassau (briefly) after William III, king of England, who was of the house of Orange-Nassau. The blue is Nassau, the orange Orange. This is the same house of Orange that is given so much prominence in Northern Ireland's Orangemen parades. Queens County included Mineola and what is now Nassau until a year after the formation of Greater New York. They fished around for a name for the new county and came up with Nassau, again taking the colors Blue (for Nassau) and Orange (for Orange). Hence the stripe on the police cars and buses.
Joe McMahon


you forgot to mention that the reason Nassau wasn't in the formation of the Greater New York was because New York City didn't annexed that part of then Queens County, and that Nassau was only named Nassau not only because it stood at one time as the name for Long Island, but it was the most mentioned name while they were looking for a name for the new county.
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petabread




Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 28

PostPosted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The MTA probably won't listen much to Nassau County. I wonder with Regional Bus Authority, which will probably get passed in Albany, wouldn't that automatically void that contract? Also, wasn't there an agreement between the MTA and Nassau that nassau would pay a certain amount, they haven't kept that up either. I understand there are politcal junk behind this but if I was the MTA and knowing that Nassau has said time and time again they want the MTA to take total financial ownership I wouldn't care too much for what Nassau is saying about colors of buses.
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S-60 To Smith Haven Mall




Joined: 29 Nov 2007
Posts: 1723
Location: Suffolk County, NY

PostPosted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

petabread wrote:
The MTA probably won't listen much to Nassau County. I wonder with Regional Bus Authority, which will probably get passed in Albany, wouldn't that automatically void that contract? Also, wasn't there an agreement between the MTA and Nassau that nassau would pay a certain amount, they haven't kept that up either. I understand there are politcal junk behind this but if I was the MTA and knowing that Nassau has said time and time again they want the MTA to take total financial ownership I wouldn't care too much for what Nassau is saying about colors of buses.


well if Nassau isn't paying the MTA then the MTA has the right to leave, not to take the bus system over, (unless there is a clause in their contract that says the MTA can take over the system fully if Nassau don't pay)

i think it depends what the NTA is doing with the Regional Bus Authority. if they are going to use it as a name to classify it as a division of the MTA then i don't think it would void the contract they already have with Nassau. but if they were going to use it as their new name then that would prob void thir contract.

but i have no idea what the MTA's contract with Nassau says and i don't know much about contracts except that they are an agreement between two people or two party's and they should be followed.

now i don't know how Nassau was before Nassau County Executive Tom Souzzi took office, but i think that Mr. Souzzi isn't a good man to run that county. so far the only Democrat i've like has been Suffolk County Executive Steve Levy. i'm so/so on President-Elect Obama, only time will tell with him.
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RailBus63
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The MTA is not fully funded by Albany. Every one of the five TA's in New York state that are set up as public benefit corporations (MTA, CDTA, CNYRTA, RGRTA and NFTA) receives funding from the local city (in NYC's case) or county. The state government simply does not have the money to fund Long Island Bus 100 percent, so there is no incentive to tell Nassau County to take a hike.

I agree that the more likely course of action if such an impasse occurs would be to announce that the MTA is closing down MSBA/Long Island Bus and is turning over all responsibility for the Nassau's bus system to the county government, a la Westchester's Bee Line. In fact, the state and MTA should consider doing this if Nassau continues to refuse to pay their fare share of the operating costs.
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Mr. Linsky
BusTalk's Offical Welcoming Committee



Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 5071
Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.

PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 2:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All this bickering over money to run the buses in what is supposed to be the richest county in the state.

However, something very interesting; I just received (from Mr. Clavin) my 2009 General Levy (Town of Hempstead - County of Nassau) and notice that the total General Purposes tax is $69,891,956.56.

This amount does not include $23 million and change for Nassau Community College, $161 million and change for County Police, $130 million and change for Police Headquarters and another $8 million and change for Fire Prevention and an Environmental Bond.

If you take the $69 million and even add the estimated $230 million in State Aid expected by the County there is a basic problem, and that is that they are not collecting enough taxes to operate!

Today, everything is in terms of billions so I can see where they're at as far as paying their fair share for bus operations - they really don't have the money.

Mr. Linsky - Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, NY
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RailBus63
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem is, Nassau County wasn't paying enough for MSBA/LI Bus even when times were much better.
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petabread




Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 28

PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2009 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First off it was Tom Souzzi who asked the MTA to take over full financial burden. The MTA told them no. Remember the fact that the fare for LIB could go up to 3.50, which is more than NYC buses. If the MTA will increase fares and take most financial responsibility, then they have the right to take the orange off.
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upperharlemline4ever




Joined: 26 Oct 2007
Posts: 60
Location: New York State

PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2009 9:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What's the big deal about the orange? New York City, Westchester County and the city of Yonkers all have orange in their colors. Using this logic the MTA should change their stripe's from solid blue to blue and orange. Come on, the blue looks just fine.
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RailBus63
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2009 12:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

petabread wrote:
First off it was Tom Souzzi who asked the MTA to take over full financial burden. The MTA told them no. Remember the fact that the fare for LIB could go up to 3.50, which is more than NYC buses. If the MTA will increase fares and take most financial responsibility, then they have the right to take the orange off.


Tom Suozzi is smart enough to know that ain't happening. This is all just posturing as both sides angle to get the best deal they can for their own interests. The orange stripe - and arguably, Long Island bus riders - are merely collateral damage in the fight.
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S-60 To Smith Haven Mall




Joined: 29 Nov 2007
Posts: 1723
Location: Suffolk County, NY

PostPosted: Mon Jan 26, 2009 10:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

petabread wrote:
First off it was Tom Souzzi who asked the MTA to take over full financial burden. The MTA told them no. Remember the fact that the fare for LIB could go up to 3.50, which is more than NYC buses. If the MTA will increase fares and take most financial responsibility, then they have the right to take the orange off.


i thought the MTA was raising the fares because they didn't have enough money and because Nassau wasn't paying their fare share, not because they wanted to have the full financial responsibility.

and if the MTA wants full financial responsibility of LIB, then i don't see why Nassau should pay them any money. then they could remove the orange stripe from the buses.

but until that time, they still have to follow the contract they had.
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