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[CT] CT Transit New Britain Kind of an Update
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thehartfordboy



Age: 31
Joined: 29 Dec 2008
Posts: 240
Location: Hartford, CT

PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HwyHaulier wrote:
Mr Linsky -

You keep surprising me with great photos from various Archives! Thanks for the great Mack shot, above...

Not exactly on topic, but... Appreciated your exhaustive indexing of the work in "Manufacturers" topic area. Located our now
one year back exchanges, Pickwick Ponderings...

And, wandering a bit in Off Topic Land, too. About Mack: Have you seen any Archivals for the line of rail D/E or G/E motor cars
it built, for main line rail use? Snappy looking designs, though photos apparently scarce...

Thehartfordboy -

Good to have your photos up. Not to fret. Best rule with photography, I've been told, is practice, practice, practice...

...................Vern................


Thank you.

Dan
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thehartfordboy



Age: 31
Joined: 29 Dec 2008
Posts: 240
Location: Hartford, CT

PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2009 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bill D wrote:
RailBus63 wrote:
Hi Bill,

What's the situation in Waterbury - how are the RTS's holding up there?


Hi Jim, best wishes for a Happy New Year!

Our RTS fleet is hanging in there. All 34 are still in service, and provide most of the service in Waterbury, as well as the Wallingford local route, and the Meriden "A" route. There is wear to the rear bulkheads, but nothing serious enough to sideline any buses. The worse case scenario would probably be a bus taking a hard hit to the rear quarter, which is always a possiblity in our hilly environment. This could potentially cause enough damage to sideline the bus permanently. Hopefully they will all last another year or two until the state can obtain funding to replace them.

The D40LF's are used in Meriden, and for tripper routes in Waterbury. Interestingly, in spite of the bad economy, some area manufacturing plants have been booming, and there are days when we have needed 5 buses to service the industrial park in Beacon Falls, as well as 3 for the Cheshire industrial park, but this is expected to slack off now that the holidays are over.

Here are some recent pictures of our fleet, taken on an October morning while I was working the early shift.









Bill


Awesome Novas and the NFs looks better than Hartfords own.
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Bill D




Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 332
Location: Waterbury, CT

PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thehartfordboy wrote:
Thanks Bill and what do you think will replace the junk piles B & C series RTS, the supposedly retired D40HFs and HART RTS, the well kept A series RTS, the D40HF suburbans in Hartford, and the Novabus Classic buses that I love the most in Connecticut. I have a feeling it is Gillig, but then again New Flyer might be the usual. As long as I see variety like the Van hools and El Doradoes, I might be happy.

Dan


New Flyer had a multi-year procurement agreement with Connecticut, which is why the D40LF became prominent. The next purchase will be under a new bid, and from what I understand, it is expected to be very competitive. I'm sure that Gillig will put a bid in, but I wonder if CT Transit would go for their product. I also expect New Flyer to bid, and both NABI and Orion have expressed some interest over the past couple of years. So keep your fingers crossed!

The D40HF's are considered part of the reserve fleet, and the HART RTS's are a "quick fix" to maintain service in New Britain. The Nova Classics seem to be holding up well, especially in New Haven, and I would guess that some of them will go into the reserve fleet when they are finally replaced. So your favorites should be around for several more years.

Bill
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RailBus63
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 9:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's too bad CT Transit didn't pick up some of the 1995 Nova RTS's that were retired not too long ago by Pioneer Valley TA in nearby Springfield Mass. - a friend of mine e-mailed a photo of one of these buses picked up by Peter Pan for shuttle service at the Foxwoods casino and it looked to be in great shape.
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thehartfordboy



Age: 31
Joined: 29 Dec 2008
Posts: 240
Location: Hartford, CT

PostPosted: Mon Jan 05, 2009 1:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bill D wrote:
thehartfordboy wrote:
Thanks Bill and what do you think will replace the junk piles B & C series RTS, the supposedly retired D40HFs and HART RTS, the well kept A series RTS, the D40HF suburbans in Hartford, and the Novabus Classic buses that I love the most in Connecticut. I have a feeling it is Gillig, but then again New Flyer might be the usual. As long as I see variety like the Van hools and El Doradoes, I might be happy.

Dan


New Flyer had a multi-year procurement agreement with Connecticut, which is why the D40LF became prominent. The next purchase will be under a new bid, and from what I understand, it is expected to be very competitive. I'm sure that Gillig will put a bid in, but I wonder if CT Transit would go for their product. I also expect New Flyer to bid, and both NABI and Orion have expressed some interest over the past couple of years. So keep your fingers crossed!

The D40HF's are considered part of the reserve fleet, and the HART RTS's are a "quick fix" to maintain service in New Britain. The Nova Classics seem to be holding up well, especially in New Haven, and I would guess that some of them will go into the reserve fleet when they are finally replaced. So your favorites should be around for several more years.

Bill


I'll guess we have to wait until March or April to see!!!

Dan
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Bill D




Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 332
Location: Waterbury, CT

PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 5:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RailBus63 wrote:
It's too bad CT Transit didn't pick up some of the 1995 Nova RTS's that were retired not too long ago by Pioneer Valley TA in nearby Springfield Mass. - a friend of mine e-mailed a photo of one of these buses picked up by Peter Pan for shuttle service at the Foxwoods casino and it looked to be in great shape.


I do not know if CT Transit considered the PVTA buses, but my understanding is that they obtained the HART RTS's for $1. A deal that's hard to beat!

Bill
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RailBus63
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2009 9:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Since the Federal Transit Administration provides the majority of funding for U.S. bus purchases and keeps track of the fleet status of various agencies, then perhaps they should also have a mechanism in place that would give other public transit operators an opportunity to buy newly retired buses before they go out to bid to scrappers or private operators. Some agencies keep their buses in great condition and those could really help operators that are struggling to come up with local matching funds to buy new replacement buses.
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Bill D




Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 332
Location: Waterbury, CT

PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 5:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RailBus63 wrote:
Since the Federal Transit Administration provides the majority of funding for U.S. bus purchases and keeps track of the fleet status of various agencies, then perhaps they should also have a mechanism in place that would give other public transit operators an opportunity to buy newly retired buses before they go out to bid to scrappers or private operators. Some agencies keep their buses in great condition and those could really help operators that are struggling to come up with local matching funds to buy new replacement buses.


A program such as this would also be beneficial to transit agencies looking to add service, especially for new routes where the ridership potential is unknown. It would certainly be a more cost effective way to establish new services, with less financial risk at both the federal and local level.

Bill
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RailBus63
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 07, 2009 9:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's also ironic that a number of CT Transit's retired MCI Classics were eagerly bought by bus rebuilders in Canada and have found a second life up north. Of course, if New Britain's maintenance is so bad that 1996 RTS's are basically junk by now, I suppose old Classics wouldn't have lasted long there.

Is there any reason why CT Transit doesn't shift some D40LF's to New Britain? Given that they are now running the New Flyer high-floor buses, it seems that 40-footers can operate there without too much trouble.
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Bill D




Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 332
Location: Waterbury, CT

PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 5:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RailBus63 wrote:
It's also ironic that a number of CT Transit's retired MCI Classics were eagerly bought by bus rebuilders in Canada and have found a second life up north. Of course, if New Britain's maintenance is so bad that 1996 RTS's are basically junk by now, I suppose old Classics wouldn't have lasted long there.

Is there any reason why CT Transit doesn't shift some D40LF's to New Britain? Given that they are now running the New Flyer high-floor buses, it seems that 40-footers can operate there without too much trouble.


Jim,

I think you may have answered your own question on this one. It seems that the buses sent to New Britain are ones which are not expected to be returned to another division. It is a shame that more of the Classics were not held for the reserve fleet, as my understand is that they were in better shape than the D40HF's. New Britain did operate T6H-5308A's for many years, so 40 foot buses should not be an issue there.

To be fair to the mechanics at New Britain Transportation, some of whom I know, they are well experienced and capable of maintaining the fleet. I believe that there are other factors there working against them, so that every day the focus is on having enough vehicles to make service, and not staying ahead on preventative maintenance.

At our operation, we learned many years ago that it is better to take care of what you have, because there is no guarantee that what replaces it will be any better. We also know not to hold our breath waiting for new buses, because they usually don't materialize until well after they should.

Bill
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RailBus63
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If I implied that the personnel in New Britain were the problem, I apologize - that was not my intent. I'm sure the mechanics are doing the best they can and I suspect that funding and resources are the issue. The state also shares some of the blame, in my opinion - those buses are due for replacement, and if funding is not going to be available to purchase new buses then they should be making sure the current fleet is receiving overhauls and other work to keep them going.
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thehartfordboy



Age: 31
Joined: 29 Dec 2008
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Location: Hartford, CT

PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2009 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RailBus63 wrote:
If I implied that the personnel in New Britain were the problem, I apologize - that was not my intent. I'm sure the mechanics are doing the best they can and I suspect that funding and resources are the issue. The state also shares some of the blame, in my opinion - those buses are due for replacement, and if funding is not going to be available to purchase new buses then they should be making sure the current fleet is receiving overhauls and other work to keep them going.


The state is most likely going to have funding to either buy buses or replace enough 1996 Classics to send to NB.

Dan
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Bill D




Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 332
Location: Waterbury, CT

PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 5:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RailBus63 wrote:
If I implied that the personnel in New Britain were the problem, I apologize - that was not my intent. I'm sure the mechanics are doing the best they can and I suspect that funding and resources are the issue. The state also shares some of the blame, in my opinion - those buses are due for replacement, and if funding is not going to be available to purchase new buses then they should be making sure the current fleet is receiving overhauls and other work to keep them going.


Jim,

No apology necessary.

I came across this news article, which express the position of NBT's management on their fleet.

http://www.newbritainherald.com/articles/2008/10/09/today%27s%20stories/20158958.prt

My interpretation is that there was an assumption that the buses would be replaced at 12 years, and they were maintained accordingly. Our fleet in Waterbury is from the same order, and we do not have these problems. We would not think of putting a bus in service without a working wheelchair lift, and have never left a wheelchair passenger at the curb for any reason. The management of NBT has been around long enough to know the realities that exsist in our "world", and should have taken better care of their fleet. I also agree with you that the state has to accept some of the blame, not only for obtaing funding, but for lacking proper oversite of the condition of the equipment, and allowing the situation to become so bad. The ignorance of the politician in this article also astounds me. (BTW - he was re-elected) The public should also be more vocal about poor service, as complaints such as those expressed in this article are few and far between.

Bill
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RailBus63
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2009 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 12-year excuse is a crutch. We all know that transit buses can last well past this with proper maintenance. It's probably unrealistic to expect that every bus in a given fleet can make it past 12 years, but the majority should be able to.

Instead of shortening the FTA timeframe to 10 years, I would like to see the guidelines modified to replace a portion of the buses at 12 years and the remainder at, say, 15 years. The FTA should also mandate minimum maintenance standards and require midlife overhauls on any buses purchased with federal funding. Our neighbors in Canada have shown that city transit buses can last 15 to 18 years and often far beyond with proper upkeep - there's no reason why we should be wasting tax dollars and junking perfectly good buses at 12 years just to meet an arbitrary standard.

Jim
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