BusTalk

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 · Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:46 pm Post subject:

Note the SURFACE buses in these two late TARS-era photos:

(West Farms Square/Southern Boulevard & Westchester Avenue)

I am sure there has been quite a bit of change in this area of the past 70-odd years; of course the TARS streetcars and SURFACE buses have long since disappeared down the echoing corridors of time......

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show/116553

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?116824

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 · Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:56 pm Post subject:

Broadway & 242nd St, late 1940's; note SURFACE bus approaching from underneath the elevated IRT station......

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?116375

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 · Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2020 8:05 pm Post subject:

See also:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surface_Transportation_Corporation *

Since the SURFACE era, the Bronx (like many other areas of the City), have seen many changes over the years.

As neighborhoods change and travel patterns change, it's a given that public transportation serving a given area is also going to experience much in the way of changes, over the years, including route changes, cutbacks, and abandonments.......

"NYO"

*Check out the MACK photo (dating from 1952) on the top right! Wink

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 · Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2020 5:42 pm Post subject:

Gun Hill Road, 1940's (note bus at left).......

https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?116719

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 · Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2020 5:54 pm Post subject:

From: "NEW YORK CITY TRANSIT BUSES" (Guy E, Martin).........

"......by March 30, 1962, only FACCO. routes #'s 2 and 6 were without service. These two routes weren't restored until July 1st of that year......."

".....the Spring of 1963 saw the arrival of 255 new TDH-5303's for MaBSTOA. Like the Board of Transportation in 1947, MaBSTOA was inherited worn-out equipment. During the 1962 strike, FAACCo. transferred 110 'good' buses to the Westchester Street Transportation Company, a Westchester county subsidiary not affected by the strike....."

".......the condemnation resulted in 1,850 buses transferred to MaBSTOA. At that time, the oldest operating buses were the 900 TDH-4510's and TDH-5101's owned by the Transit Authority......"

"......newer, but in worse shape overall, were the buses transferred from SURFACE TRANSIT. Compounding the issue was that while the City inherited the buses, it had yet to receive the overhaul facilities. Repairs proceeded, but at a slow pace, at TA-owned garages......"

"NYO"

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 · Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2020 12:27 am Post subject:

Collectibles......

Yesterday, I received several collectible MaBSTOA items that I purchased off eBay; one was a lot of seven TT's, all near-mint, dating from the 1960's (the covers show a young lady and her daughter, both stylishly dressed, boarding a new Fishbowl (driver is in full uniform!)
_____________________________________________________________

1: BX15/BX15A (GUN HILL RD/HILLSIDE HOMES)

2: BX15B (BAYCHESTER AVENUE)

3: BX17 (ALLERTON AVENUE)

4: BX18 (MACOMBS RD)

5: BX24 (BAILEY AVENUE)

6: BX41 (WEBSTER AVENUE/WHITE PLAINS ROAD)

7: BX42 (WESTCHESTER AVENUE)
_____________________________________________________________

These TT's have a number of interesting "footnotes", including the following from the "BX15" issue:
____________________________________________________________

"WEEKDAY, SATURDAY, AND SUNDAY NIGHTS, BUSES OPERATE ON A 36-MINUTE HEADWAY VIA A LOOP COMPRISING GUN HILL RD, BOSTON RD, WESTCHESTER RD, AND GUN HILL RD TO 206th ST."
____________________________________________________________

I also (from a different dealer) obtained an early (pre-"OA" era) cap badge, #1332.

Another vintage"Noo Yawk" bus item I purchased was a (cloth) rollsign section, reading:
___________________________________________________________

"15-LIMITED STOPS"

On the right-hand edge of this section is a small white "tag" reading:

"16 ELMHST"
_____________________________________________________________

"NYO"

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 · Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2020 5:06 pm Post subject:

.....am also (eagerly!) awaiting the arrival of an old car card (from eBay):

"THE M104 TAKES A TURN FOR THE BETTER" (will post "particulars" when the card arrives)..... Wink

"NYO"

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 · Posted: Tue Nov 17, 2020 1:00 pm Post subject:

Regarding the aforementioned 1960's MaBSTOA timetables I recently purchased.......

On some routes, I was, I admit, a bit surprised to see that some lines had pretty long headways, even on weekdays.

The shortest headways I could find were for buses on the "B15"/"B15X" (every 5 minutes, leaving 206th St., at certain times)

Also regarding these routes, there is a lengthy "gap" between departures leaving 206th St., from 9:36 AM to 1:40 PM (granted, the Bronx also, and still does, have a number of subway options, in most areas)

With the "BX15b", on weekdays, the first bus left Boston Road at 6:55 AM, with the last AM departure being at 9:54 AM; headways were 36 minutes.

There was no weekend service offered.......

"NYO"

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 · Posted: Tue Nov 17, 2020 2:57 pm Post subject:

In an earlier post here, I mentioned that I was expecting delivery of an old "M104" car card; 15 minutes ago, it arrived on my doorstep, and I, of course, couldn't wait to get it out of its cardboard packing...... Wink

"THE M104 TAKES A TURN FOR THE BETTER"

"THE M104 VIA 8TH AVENUE, ALL DAY LONG"

"JUST AS ALWAYS. FROM THE EASTSIDE TO THE WEST, ALONG 42nd ST. AND UP 8TH AVENUE. ALL THE WAY TO COLUMBUS CIRCLE, AND THEN UP BROADWAY. A CONVENIENT, EASY WAY TO GET TO WORK. JUST LOOK FOR THE 'VIA 8TH AVE.' SIGN IN THE FRONT WINDOW OF THE BUS, AND YOU'RE ON YOUR WAY!"

Also:

"STARTING MARCH 22ND, EVERY THIRD M104 WILL TRAVEL ALONG 42nd ST., AND TURN UP 6TH AVENUE, INSTEAD. SO, IF YOU'VE HAD TO WALK FROM GRAND CENTRAL TO, SAY, ROCKEFELLER CENTER, NOW YOU CAN RIDE THERE."

"JUST LOOK FOR THE 'VIA 6TH AVENUE' SIGN IN THE FRONT OF THE BUS TO MAKE SURE ITS THE M104 YOU WANT."

"THE M104 VIA 6TH AVENUE (AVENUE OF THE AMERICAS) FROM 7:50 AM TO 1:15PM"

(in the bottom right-hand corner of this card, is the "M" insignia, with a partial side view of a "Batwing" Fishbowl)........ Wink

"NYO"

W.B. Fishbowl · Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:24 am Post subject:

That would have been in 1976. So now we know on exactly what date this "split" occurred.

X-Astorian · Joined: 19 Feb 2009 Posts: 168 Location: Central NJ

NYO, is this the item you mentioned?

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 · Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:22 am Post subject:

X-Astorian:

Yup, that's the car card that I had described yesterday; W.B.: appreciate the date of when the route "split" took place.

The ad card had the "look" of the late 70's, and, given the fact that a Fishbowl was on the card, and not a GRUMMAN or an RTS, I was pretty well certain that this ad pe-dated both buses in the MaBSTOA/"Em-Tee-Yay" fleet.

Again, appreciate your input....... Very Happy

"NYO"

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 · Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:33 am Post subject:

W.B.:

Was again flipping through those 1960's MaBSTOA TT's that I added to my collection last week; it would be interesting to compare those routes to the (renumbered) routes of today, and compare headways, route changes, etc.

BX15/BX15A (combined TT)

BX15B

BX17

BX18

BX24

BX41

BX42

As I had mentioned in my original post, these TT's date back to the 1960's.......

"NYO"

X-Astorian · Joined: 19 Feb 2009 Posts: 168 Location: Central NJ

You're probably already aware of the 1984 Bronx changes when route numbers just went from one to another without logical reason (at least to me) but here's the brochure. It should make it easier comparing headways of the 60s to the present.

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 · Posted: Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:36 pm Post subject:

X-Astorian:

THANK YOU for posting these items; I also agree with you as to the number changes.....why not leave well enough alone?

After all, riders had been familiar with those numbers for quite awhile, by that time.

NJT, in its many quirks, has, in some instances, retained old route numbers (the #'s 165 and #166, for instance, were PSNJ route numbers), while, in others, the numbers were changed to totally unfamiliar digits.

As an example, the "#21", which I rode on for years, was renumbered "#181"; this route (which ran between Fort Lee and Hoboken) now only operates during rush hours, and now runs from the GWB terminal to the HBLR station at 48th St. in Union City, no longer providing through service to either Weehawken or Hoboken

Getting back to MaBSTOA, it must have been interesting, to say the least, to see work being performed on updated roller curtains for the Fishbowls and the Flexies.

By 1984, you also had the newer buses, equipped with electronic signage.......

"NYO"