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History repeating itself? (sort of)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 9685
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 11:10 pm    Post subject: History repeating itself? (sort of) Reply with quote

The new R-179 subway car fleet has been sidelined due to mechanical issues, and the few remaining sets of venerable R-42's have been brought out of retirement (despite their less-than-stellar condition) to help fill in the gaps.

I'm sure every available R-32 "Brightliner" (that is, what remains of them) will also be riding the rails, pinch-hitting for their sidelined, modern-day counterparts.

Recall now, nearly 40 years back, when the MTA's new GRUMMAN's were pulled for service, due to a number of issues; not only did the MTA bring out a number of older "Tee-Yay" buses that had been stored, they also saw an influx of Fishbowls and New Looks trekking up from DC, to help fill in the gap left by the sidelined GRUMMAN fleet.

Of course, with the OOS R-179's, DC cannot help the MTA, in this instance!

In closing, I certainly hope none of the modern fleet members of the MTA bus fleet will develop issues that would sideline them........after all, the MTA no reserve fleet, or "stockpile", if you will, of retired RTS's on standby.....

"NYO"


Last edited by NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 on Wed Jan 08, 2020 11:25 pm; edited 2 times in total
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 9685
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

........too, recall, the issues then surrounding the issue-plagued R-44's and 46's, back in the the 70's; I remember reading of retired prewar IND cars being put back into service, due to the unexpected equipment shortage......

"NYO"

*I also remember there were also problems with cracks in the Rockwell trucks; if my memory serves me correctly (I was then riding R-10's downtown on the "CC" each morning; there were problems with (the R-46's?) trucks (this was later, in the early 80's)

I was surprised to see R-10's working on the "E", which surprised me, as the "E" (since I had started working downtown) ran the newer cars, which I then avoided at all costs.

Of course, my railfan heart then belonged to those classic (though graffiti-scarred) R-10 "Thunderbirds"..........


Last edited by NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 on Thu Jan 09, 2020 12:11 am; edited 2 times in total
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 9685
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Wed Jan 08, 2020 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interestingly, on an earlier Eyewitness News (ABC 7) report dealing with the sidelined R-179's, footage was shown showing new CTA cars being built at the Bombardier plant........

"NYO"
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
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Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Thu Jan 09, 2020 11:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

"Back to the future"? (from McCausland's: "RAPID TRANSIT SERIES BUSES" )

"....between 1979 and 1980, close to 640 buses had been delivered to the MTA, but, by November, all (GRUMMANS) were ordered off the streets......."

Fast-forward now to January, 2020:

Nearly 300 new R-179 subway cars have been sidelined.

One cannot help but wonder what things might have been like, four decades ago, had the MTA decided to purchased RTS's instead of GRUMMANS......

"NYO"

*Too, one has to wonder what today's subway fleet might be like, if even a few of the old car builders (ACF, ST. LOUIS, BUDD, etc.) were still in business.......
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2020 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

........personally, I think it would be wise for the MTA (or, for that matter, ANY transit agency) to keep some sort of "reserve" fleet on hand, in case of some sort of emergency situation that might find newer equipment being pulled from service, for whatever reason.

Personally, I always thought it wise to have some sort of a "contingency plan", in any given situation .........

"NYO"
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2020 10:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

.........as the 60's were poised to enter the history books, no thought was given about "reserve" equipment in New York, whether it ran on the rails or rubber tires.

The least of the famed BMT "Standards" were retired in 1969, as new R-42's arrived on "Tee-Yay" property.

The last of the venerable prewar IRT cars on the Bronx 3rd Avenue El were retired, as were the remaining MACKS.

With both bus and rapid transit equipment of the day still being built on our shores, and, also, being built to rugged standards, it would seem to me that few (if any) were then even remotely thinking of the "Tee-Yay'/MTA ever "stockpiling" older equipment to use in case of emergencies.

Of course, there were no need of replacements when the ancient wooden BMT "Q" cars were retired in 1969, as the Myrtle Avenue El was closed and there was no need for new equipment, with the El poised for demolition.

A half-century ago, no one in transit could have foreseen a future time when a brand-new fleet of GRUMMAN buses would have to be pulled from service due to safety issues; likewise, no one would have thought of seeing nearly 300 new subway cars being yanked from service, also over safety issues.

Times change, indeed.........


"NYO"


Last edited by NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 on Mon Jan 13, 2020 11:27 pm; edited 1 time in total
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

....recalling the days when both buses and subway cars, once "on the job", REMAINED on the job.....for MANY years!! Very Happy

Of course, the buses and rapid transit cars of that era WERE (solidly!) built right here at home....... Wink

http://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?793

http://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?836

(courtesy: bus.nycsubway.org)

http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?26222

http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show/87189

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
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Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

......and....when the GRUMMANS first hit the streets of Gotham 40-odd years ago, who could have foretold what undignified fate awaited these new vehicles, in the near-term?

http://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?1258

(courtesy: bus.nycsubway.org)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NTT's.............

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Technology_Train
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 11:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ahhhh, the venerable, classic Peter Witt streetcar and the sleek, ever-timeless GMC Old Look; how evocative both vehicles were, in reflecting a long-ago era when transit vehicles were indeed built to last.........

http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?31063

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2020 11:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Courtesy of MaBSTOA, we have here classic examples of when modern transit coaches were not only RUGGED and DEPENDABLE, but also, built the RIGHT way, AND, also, built here right here in the good ol' USA....... Very Happy

http://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?3184

http://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?3196

(courtesy: bus.nycsubway.org)
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W.B. Fishbowl



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It could be argued about the sidelined Bombardier R-179's, that they basically live up to the first syllable of the company name. Which also reminds me of the old World War II cliché, "Pilot to Bombardier . . . "
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W.B. Fishbowl



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 9:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 wrote:
Ahhhh, the venerable, classic Peter Witt streetcar and the sleek, ever-timeless GMC Old Look; how evocative both vehicles were, in reflecting a long-ago era when transit vehicles were indeed built to last.........

http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?31063

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)

And a long-gone era of numerals of the type that would later show up on TA and MaBSTOA 'New Looks'. Coupled with the numbers inside a Brooklyn Bus from the 1930's, they would determine the 'look' of bus fleets for generations.
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

W.B. Fishbowl wrote:
It could be argued about the sidelined Bombardier R-179's, that they basically live up to the first syllable of the company name. Which also reminds me of the old World War II cliché, "Pilot to Bombardier . . . "


W.B.:

LOL!!!!!!! Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

RIGHT ON THE MARK!!!!!!!!!!! Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy

It is strange to think that all the builders of subway cars (and commuter stock) as well as buses have vanished like early-morning mist; ACF, PULLMAN-STANDARD, PRESSED STEEL, BUDD, ST. LOUIS, GMC, FLXIBLE, et al.

One has to go back a number of decades to when GMC was producing vast numbers of rugged, solid, dependable (and attractive!), and companies like ST. LOUIS, BUDD, and ACF were turning out rugged, railcars that lasted for decades in service.

IMHO, GMC was the undisputed "King Of Buses", both transit and highway.

The GMC's truly were "Americs's Buses"! Wink

"NYO"
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




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PostPosted: Thu Jan 16, 2020 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

W.B. Fishbowl wrote:
NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 wrote:
Ahhhh, the venerable, classic Peter Witt streetcar and the sleek, ever-timeless GMC Old Look; how evocative both vehicles were, in reflecting a long-ago era when transit vehicles were indeed built to last.........

http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?31063

(courtesy: nycsubway.org)

And a long-gone era of numerals of the type that would later show up on TA and MaBSTOA 'New Looks'. Coupled with the numbers inside a Brooklyn Bus from the 1930's, they would determine the 'look' of bus fleets for generations.


W.B.:

Though we've discussed this before, here, you've brought up a very interesting observation, one that, I'm sure, "average" people would not have even noticed throughout the years.

After all, to them, a number is simply a NUMBER, with no thought given to the STYLE or TYPE of number they are seeing.

Personally, I always thought that numerals of that type were classic in their own right, and, indeed, looked "quite at home" on the buses......

"NYO"


Last edited by NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 on Thu Jan 16, 2020 10:56 am; edited 1 time in total
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