BusTalk Forum Index BusTalk
A Community Discussing Buses and Bus Operations Worldwide!
 
 BusTalk MainBusTalk Main FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups BusTalk GalleriesBusTalk Galleries   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Articulated MTA buses....when were the first?

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    BusTalk Forum Index -> New York City Buses
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 7056
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2019 1:23 am    Post subject: Articulated MTA buses....when were the first? Reply with quote

Barring "demo" units....

1:When did the first artics enter service, and on what routes?

2:What older buses did these replace?

3:How long did these original artics remain in service?

4:How many artics are in the MTA fleet today; which are the oldest and which are the newest?

5:How many types (or series) of artics are in MTA service today?

Thanks in advance for any info.....

"NYO"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
GojiMet86



Age: 26
Joined: 12 Jul 2013
Posts: 120

PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1) Those would have been the 1996 New Flyer D60HF. Series range 1000-1109, out of Manhattan and the Bronx.

2) Don't know.

3) They were replaced from 2010-2012.

4+5) There will be about 1172 artic units in service once the electric artics come in (actually 1170, since two older buses have been written off).

YEARS MODEL RANGE (# Units)

NOVA (582)
2010-2011 LFSA 1200-1289 (90)
2011-2012 LFSA 5770-5986 (217)
2012-2013 LFSA 5253-5363 (111)
2017-2019 LFSA 5439-5602 (164)

NEW FLYER (590)
2012-2013 XD60 4710-4799 (90)
2015-2016 XD60 5364-5438 (75)
2016-2019 XD60 5987-6286 (300)
2017-2018 XN60 1000-1109 (110)
2019-2020 XE60 4950-4964 (15)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 7056
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MANY THANKS for your input; MUCH appreciated!

I see that my memory was correct; I can remember the MTA getting its first artics long after NJT was already operating them (NJT began taking delivery of the [now retired] VOLVO artics about 1988/1989; the current artics operated by NJT are all NEOPLANS, soon to be retired themselves)

Did not know about the new electric artics.....these sound like interesting buses!

I have always found it interesting that it took so long for artics to become commonplace here in the States, as compared to many cities in Europe.

True, there WERE non-demo articulated buses in service many, many years ago, but all were ultra-minorities in whatever fleet they operated in (CONTINENTAL TRAILWAYS, for instance, operated the "SUPER EAGLE" artics, and postwar TWIN COACH artics once operated in Omaha; there was also a CTA artic trolleybus, I believe, at one time)

Though I'm not really into modern buses, I DO find the artics interesting vehicles....... Very Happy

"NYO"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 7056
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Regarding articulated buses in general, the Spring, 1986 issue of the old "BUS WORLD" magazine had an excellent feature article (several pages, w/many good photos) on articulated buses, "SUCCESS WITH A TWIST" (Van Wilkins)

At the time of publication, quite a few North American cities were already operating artics.

M.A.N., by far, supplied the largest amount of artics to these cities (1,246 diesel, 46 trolley bus)

The other players were CROWN-IKARUS, NEOPLAN, VOLVO, GENERAL MOTORS DIESEL DIVISION (Canada), and ORION-IKARUS.

NJT's VOLVOS were then to be ordered; 50 in transit configuration, and 60 in suburban configuration (today, NJT's 9600 series NEOPLAN artics are suburban models, while the 9500's are in transit configuration. Most NEOPLANS based at the FAIRVIEW garage are 9600's, but there are also a few 9500's on hand at this location)

When this article was published, it would still be another decade before the MTA's first artics entered service.....

"NYO"


Last edited by NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 on Sun Dec 01, 2019 4:43 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
frankie



Age: 72
Joined: 01 Feb 2011
Posts: 722
Location: St. Peters, Mo.

PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually the first articulated buses to see revenue service in New York was the single Twin-Coach Super-Twin demo #400 back in 1947. Even though it only flexed vertically, it's still considered as articulated.

It was only used in Brooklyn on both the Third Ave and Flatbush Ave lines. Reading the text with the accompanying photos says it all.

BTW, this bus was officially licensed in New York using the number block reserved for New York City buses that year. (bottom left photo).

Frankie

(attachments to follow)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 7056
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frankie:

Thanks for input, as always. Wink

Yes, I've seen photos of this TWIN COACH (imagine this monster in the MTA's Museum Fleet today?? Shocked)

Also, in 1938, TWIN COACH built one (the "Super Twin") articulated transit bus for Baltimore's BTC; this was #1019, also known as the "Queen Mary".

The huge unit could not bend horizontally, making it very difficult for the driver to round corners.

In the late 40's, Omaha took delivery of 15 "SUPER TWIN" articulated buses; again, these buses could bend vertically, but not horizontally......

"NYO"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
GojiMet86



Age: 26
Joined: 12 Jul 2013
Posts: 120

PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 wrote:
MANY THANKS for your input; MUCH appreciated!

I see that my memory was correct; I can remember the MTA getting its first artics long after NJT was already operating them (NJT began taking delivery of the [now retired] VOLVO artics about 1988/1989; the current artics operated by NJT are all NEOPLANS, soon to be retired themselves)




NJT just received its first New Flyer Xcelsior XD60, 20801, of the 2-door type.

It follows the newest numbering scheme (last 2 digits of the year being the first 2 digits of the number). The MCI D4500CT already follow this:
16001-16003
17001-17240
18001-18129
19001-19182
20001-20183

So the new order of 85 buses (with an option for another 85) will be 20801-20885 (with the option perhaps 21801-21885).



NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 wrote:
Did not know about the new electric artics.....these sound like interesting buses!


They should be in service soon. The MTA recently announced in their October 2019 Transit and Bus Committee Meeting plans for:

NYCTA
375 40 ft. electric buses
713 40 ft. non-electric buses
100 60 ft. electric buses
115 express coaches

MTABC
25 40 ft. electric buses
520 40 ft. non-electric buses
79 60 ft. non-electric buses
250 express coaches
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 7056
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sun Dec 01, 2019 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GojiMet86:

Thanks for all the interesting input, regarding the new NJT New Flyer artics; I've not seen any photos of them as yet.

As I live only a few blocks away from the route of the #159/159R, I hope to see them sometime soon! Very Happy

Currently, the NEOPLAN artics (mostly 9600's along with a few 9500's) along with the NABI's, provide all service on these routes (on occasion, an MCI can also be seen on the #159R); these buses are based at FAIRVIEW (the former ORANGE & BLACK garage on Anderson Avenue)

IMHO, I think that the NEOPLANS have served quite well over their 15 years or so in service; certainly, they were a great improvement over the old VOLVO units, which were VERY underpowered climbing grades (in the summer, I recall many times when the a/c would have to be cut while climbing the steep Gorge Road hill on an outbound #159 run)

Their a/c also left a lot to be desired, and their seat cusions were forever coming loose from the frames.

I never liked the way the VOLVO units handled in slippery weather; the rear section was to be avoided at ALL costs, unless you were really into thrill rides!

Thanks again for your input....much appreciated.......

"NYO"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 7056
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 12:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

"BACK TO THE FUTURE" (1974)

It would be over two decades after these photos were snapped when articulated buses would start becoming commonplace on MTA routes.......

http://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?631

http://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?625

http://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?628

(courtesy: bus.nycsubway.org)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 7056
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 10:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

.....this morning, when I went for the paper, I noticed that there were no articulateds to be seen on either the #159 or the #159R (MCI's seemed to be subbing for the artics; NABI's were still running, as usual)

I guess with the sloppy weather to come later today, NJT (wisely) decided to pull at least some of the artics from service (many years ago, the old VOLVO articulateds were to be avoided, if at all possible, during snowy/icy conditions...Your's Truly speaks from YEARS of experience as a commuter, here!) Wink

"NYO"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 7056
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Mon Dec 02, 2019 8:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A few more MTA "artic" questions:

1: Are today's artics "pushers" or "pullers"?

2: How do "veteran" MTA drivers rate the current artic fleet compared to the now-retired units?

3: How well do these buses handle grades?

4: How many MTA depots stable artics?

Thanks in advance for your input......

"NYO"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 7056
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

IMHO, one of the WISEST moves that the MTA ever made was NOT purchasing VOLVO artics, back in the 80's.

I commuted on these buses (NJT) for a number of years, and I never liked them (outside of their engine sound)

Their a/c's were nothing at all to write home about, they were certainly UNDERPOWERED when climbing ANY sort of grade, and the rear sections swung about fat too much for my tastes during wintry conditions.

The MTA missed nuthin' my not buying VOLVO artics, IMHO.....

"NYO"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 7056
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some good artic photos on this page........

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MTA_Regional_Bus_Operations_bus_fleet
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    BusTalk Forum Index -> New York City Buses All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You can attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group