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Two on FACC.........
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traildriver




Joined: 26 Mar 2011
Posts: 1130
Location: Queens, NY

PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2018 11:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

W.B. Fishbowl wrote:
NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 wrote:
It's fun (at least to me) to imagine our favorite bus driver, Ralph Kramden, driving for FACCo. instead of the Gotham Bus Company (my sincere apologies to Mr. Marshall!)

Gotham Bus, as an entity, seemed to have been loosely based on NYC Omnibus (which was an "affiliate" of FACCo due to both being owned by the same out-of-town firm up to 1954), and Mr. Marshall - wasn't he based, equally loosely, on longtime FACCo, NYCO, and later Surface Transit president John E. McCarthy?

Interestingly, in closeups the cap Gleason wore as Ralph bore the name of another firm which I'm wondering about its history - La Follette Coach Lines.


I never noticed that, but the next time I get a chance to watch "The Honeymooner's", I'll be sure to look for it....

Could be that the propmaster grabbed whatever was available, thinking that no one would "notice" the discrepancy....
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 5301
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2018 11:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

traildriver:

In one of the later color "Honeymooners", an episode began showing a model of the GOTHAM BUS COMPANY garage, with a toy bus entering the portal (I believe that the bus was being pulled on a string by a prop man)

The scene then shifted to the driver's locker room (if memory serves me correctly), where the story began.

Man, I haven't seen this one in AGES..... Rolling Eyes

"NYO"
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traildriver




Joined: 26 Mar 2011
Posts: 1130
Location: Queens, NY

PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2018 11:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah...the live television shows from that era were sure not what one would deem as "high-tech", for sure.... Smile
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 5301
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

traildriver wrote:
Yeah...the live television shows from that era were sure not what one would deem as "high-tech", for sure.... Smile


traildriver:

I was just recalled a little skit from the old "JACKIE GLEASON SHOW"; Gleason (as RK) was in the driver's seat of a city bus mockup, and he's barking to the crowd boarding, "MOVE TO THE REAR!"

Well, what happened was, the front of the bus reared up into the air! Shocked

I still remember my Dad getting a big laugh out of it........man, where have the decades gotten to......?? Rolling Eyes

"NYO"
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 5301
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

All:

We have often discussed here the "bias", if you will, towards FACCo.'s New Looks.

It seems that in any detailed work (or discussion) on the Company, the New Looks are either totally ignored, or, at best, represented with one or two photos, at best.

In Guy E. Martin's "NEW YORK CITY TRANSIT BUSES" (in the FACCo. chapter) there are a number of Old Look photos (I'm NOT complaining, mind you!), but only TWO of the New Looks (buses #'s 4 and 3110)

My issue is twofold:

1: If there are TWO photos published of FACCo. New Looks, surely, there must be a number of others.

2: When one reads of the Company's fleet from the earliest double-decker days to the end of the Company's reign, the New Looks are usually only briefly touched upon, or, worse yet, not mentioned at all.

IMHO, the New Looks were an important part of the Company's rich history (think of transit historians ignoring the iconic double-deckers!) and should not, under any circumstances, be ignored.

Just my opinion, here.....

"NYO"
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W.B. Fishbowl



Age: 51
Joined: 02 Oct 2014
Posts: 313
Location: New York, New York, USA

PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 3:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agreed, and for a few reasons:

a) A shot of FACL and ST president John E. McCarthy with Mayor Robert F. Wagner standing next to a demo New Look in late 1959 (the company was a follower as opposed to a leader in this regard, compared with the "Tee-Yay" whose first New Looks [1-190] were already on the road within NYC when FACL's first New Looks [including the ten air-conditioned units] made their debuts).

b) There are definitely some other shots of FACL and ST New Looks "out there" if you will. One of the ST units (on the Bx-31 - Southern Boulevard line) can be seen on Flickr, another was in a book by Guy E. Martin of buses that were delivered to the various NYC area transit entities between 1945 and 1975, and still another (3172) was featured in a movie where it was plying the M-106 - 42nd Street Crosstown at the time. As for FACL's allotment, there was also 3103, 3104 and 3105; 3123 (running of Rt. 5 - Fifth Ave./Riverside Drive on a snowy day), 3156 (on Rt. 16 - 34th St. Crosstown, thus indicating 54th Street depot origin) . . .

c) These were among the first buses to have front and side roll signs made by Transign (though by the time they were all consigned to the Kingsbridge depot in the Bronx within several years of the MaBSTOA takeover, such signs had all been replaced by "old-style" cloth signs).

d) Together with the TA units, the FACL and ST buses were among the first in NYC to be built to 102" width after the ban on such widths was lifted; plus being among the first to have ad racks on the outsides of the buses after the ban on that was rescinded.

These, I think, would belong in a book dealing with the Fifth Avenue Coach Lines (and Surface Transit) era of 1956-62. And that reminds me: Why has there never been a book out on New York City Omnibus that would have pics of the various models that entity ran?
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W.B. Fishbowl



Age: 51
Joined: 02 Oct 2014
Posts: 313
Location: New York, New York, USA

PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 3:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629 wrote:
In Guy E. Martin's "NEW YORK CITY TRANSIT BUSES" (in the FACCo. chapter) there are a number of Old Look photos (I'm NOT complaining, mind you!), but only TWO of the New Looks (buses #'s 4 and 3110)

There was a New Look in the chapter of Surface Transportation / Surface Transit. What escapes me was what bus number that was, and on which Bronx route it was running when that photo was taken.
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 5301
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

W.B:

As usual, a thorough "thesis" and a well-written post........great info! Wink

Personally, I would like to see a book dealing with FACCo. in its post-double decker years, focusing on equipment and operations from the the last double deckers to the first New Looks (and the end of the Company).

Photo-(and text-wise) I personally feel this is much, much more on the latter days of the Company this is yet to be told.......

"NYO"
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 5301
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2018 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Photos of FACCo.'s early single-deck buses are rare, compared to photos of the double-deckers.

Here is an undated photo of #1030; note the side sign is set for Route #1 (YORK AVE.), while the front sign reads "SPECIAL".

No other info on this old photo.......

http://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?3385

(courtesy: bus.nycsubway.org)
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NEW YORK OMNIBUS 2629




Joined: 18 Dec 2007
Posts: 5301
Location: NEW JOISEY

PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2018 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Two photos of a classic FACCo. open-topper (#1220)

Though riding on the open upper deck must have been truly splendid on fine days, one cannot help but be practicle and wonder about inclement days.

It would seem that only the hardiest souls would dare brave the elements "up top", on a raw, chilly, rainy/snowy day.

At least, on a streetcar, elevated train, or subway, you were inside the vehicle and protected from the weather.......

http://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?2386

http://bus.nycsubway.org/perl/show?3400

(courtesy: bus.nycsubway.org)
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