BusTalk Forum Index BusTalk
A Community Discussing Buses and Bus Operations Worldwide!
 
 BusTalk MainBusTalk Main FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups BusTalk GalleriesBusTalk Galleries   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Question on Post-1962 History of Some MaBSTOA Routes

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    BusTalk Forum Index -> New York City Buses
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
W.B. Fishbowl



Age: 51
Joined: 02 Oct 2014
Posts: 241
Location: New York, New York, USA

PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 2:21 am    Post subject: Question on Post-1962 History of Some MaBSTOA Routes Reply with quote

On other sites, 'X-Astorian' put up a list of Fifth Avenue Coach routes from 1 to 20 as published in the July-August 1971 issue of Motor Coach Age. As 'MaBSTOA 15' has in the past uploaded pages from that same publication's May 1972 look at MaBSTOA's first 10 years (notably of bus rosters and route assignments as of February 1970, and the buses seized by the city by condemnation in 1962), questions I have relating to the period up to the January 1966 one-way conversions of Fifth and Madison Avenues, and Broadway between 14th and 23rd Streets (the last section of the last-named thoroughfare to be converted to one-way southbound), are as follows:
- According to a Jan. 14, 1966 Daily News article about the changes to bus routes along Fifth and Madison, the ex-FACCo Fifth and Seventh Avenues route was already referred to as '2A'; I presume by then its garage route assignment had been transferred from 132nd Street to 146th Street, and the 'A' suffix added on due to ex-NYCO 2 - Park & Madison via 116th Street already being assigned there. At what point would this depot transfer have been effective? I assume it preceded by some time the Fifth and Madison one-way conversions. It certainly explains how and why the ex-FACCo route had become '2A'.
- A 1964 bus map put out by Bloomingdale's already had the (ex-NYCO) 1 - Park & Madison via 135th Street's southern terminus at South Ferry, and the 7 - Broadway, Columbus & Lenox Avenues' at 14th Street-Union Square West. Would such south end extensions (from Park Row/City Hall and 23rd Street & Broadway, respectively) have taken effect on or about March 1, 1964 - the same day 7's transition route was shifted NB from 53rd Street to Central Park South, and SB from 54th Street to 58th from Ninth to Eighth, then Eighth to Columbus Circle and CPS to Seventh Avenue?
- In the days of NYC Omnibus and then Fifth Avenue Coach Lines' NYCO Division, the 1's transition between Park and Madison was 42nd Street in both directions, and the 2's at 27th Street NB and 26th Street SB. When would the 1's transitions have been moved to 39th Street NB and 40th Street SB (likewise already in place by 1964), and the 2's NB transition to 25th (ditto)?

And would the MaBSTOA piece have a list of routes and capsuled description of important service changes in the way the FACCo piece had?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
MaBSTOA 15



Age: 64
Joined: 27 Feb 2013
Posts: 367

PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hope these postings help to answer your question(s)...


FACCO ROUTES.JPG
 Description:
 Filesize:  140.65 KB
 Viewed:  317 Time(s)

FACCO ROUTES.JPG



NYCO ROUTES.JPG
 Description:
 Filesize:  189 KB
 Viewed:  317 Time(s)

NYCO ROUTES.JPG


Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
MaBSTOA 15



Age: 64
Joined: 27 Feb 2013
Posts: 367

PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is for the Surface Transit routes


SURFACE ROUTES.JPG
 Description:
 Filesize:  168.18 KB
 Viewed:  316 Time(s)

SURFACE ROUTES.JPG



SURFACE ROUTES 2.JPG
 Description:
 Filesize:  180.13 KB
 Viewed:  316 Time(s)

SURFACE ROUTES 2.JPG


Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
W.B. Fishbowl



Age: 51
Joined: 02 Oct 2014
Posts: 241
Location: New York, New York, USA

PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 5:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mucho thanks, as always. But I couldn't help but notice reading about the reroutings of 2, 3 and 5 as from Washington Square Park to 8th Street and University Place. The capsuled service change description listed the date as March 10, 1963 - but from my research of old New York Times articles, the actual date would have been Sept. 2, 1963 - the day Washington Square was officially closed to bus traffic. I also saw how 13 - 8th Street Crosstown (today's M8 ) was listed as moving from 12th Street to 54th Street on March 2, 1969, but a dispatcher's map I saw at the Transit Museum had the said route at 54th Street as of April 1968. (Could the transfer have been more 1965?)

But in a sense, it was also a little premature, in that it was some months before the last GM New Looks ever ordered - T6H-5309A (4800-4919, ordered in two spurts) and express T6H-5310A (4500-4505) - were introduced to MaBSTOA routes, and on Manhattan routes the 'M' prefix began appearing on most lines (except the Jackson Heights and Elmhurst Crosstown which were designated QM15 and QM16, respectively); not to mention the opening of the vast Hudson depot, the reshuffling of many routes there, and the closure of 12th Street. Plus two years before the great route renumberings (which saw Bx15C, which only replaced Bx17 in 1971, revert to Bx17 - only one example of 20).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    BusTalk Forum Index -> New York City Buses All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You can attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group