BusTalk

[Mr. Linsky]

JFK Depot - Rockaway Boulevard Garage.

The old Green Bus Lines garage hasen't changed that much in 55 years!

That's right, your 'JFK Depot' (A/K/A 'The Rockaway Boulevard Garage') was built in 1952 after the company was politely asked by the Port Authority (under the threat of 'Eminent Domain') to vacate their former premises located a stone's throw away in Cornell Park.

The new facility, which could house as many as 160 buses, was the talk of the industry and featured the latest in service and maintenace equpment including a state of the art paint and body shop.

Transit officials from both the private and public sectors came from all over the northeast to inspect the facilities and to take notes.

In fact, Bus Transportation, which was the industry bible at the time, did a cover story on the company's new digs as did GM in an ad brochure pictured below.

I'm sure that JFK Depot will stand for at least another 55 years as an MTA facility and as a monument to the great company that built it!

Mr. Linsky
"The Green Hornet"
Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica & Arverne, NY

[Mr RT]

"the great company that built it"
They were great once, but at the time of the take over that definitely wasn't the case, i.e. the was withholding money, so Cooper wasn't going to let that effect their profit, so guess what suffered .... maintenance & service !

"state of the art in 1952"
That was in 1952. When I first visited the depot I thought it was a dirty dump ! It has been cleaned up somewhat now (was there Saturday).

"first class paint shop"
Nope ... they now use one corner of the building with a curtain on one side to restrain the spray.

Nothing in life stays the same my friend, including that company that you have such fond memories of.

[Mr. Cooper]

Mr RT I think you are right. Nothing is more superior then Queens Surface's garage. I think its great NYCDOT built QS a new garage and replaced all the 85 GMC RTS and some 93-94 TMC RTS with new Orion CNG. Heck, why not replace everything for QS to dig them out of that poor image they had in the 90s. Very nice how QS stood there with the hand out for as many hand-outs from NYCDOT as they could get, while everybody else got QS TMC "JUNK" added to there fleet. Ever on a bus when it rolls down the 164st hill backwards? I was, scared the "S" out of me. Nothing like 2/3 up and next thing going back down. Even better when the bus actually made it up the hill, not people walking past faster. Want to toss more out there, nice MTAB redone the shop floors in CPD so there actually flat. Green did keep 22 year old buses running everyday. Yeah NYCDOT was withholding money from Cooper, and every week the paychecks were still good, HE MADE SURE OF IT!! "Cooper wasn't going to let that effect their profit", want me to visit a stock holder I know to find out how many dividend checks he did not receive because of NYCDOT stiffing Cooper?
Next time you want to bash, be fair about it.

[petabread]

They don't use the paint corner for painting. I've only seen them strip buses there after that they are taken somewhere else for painting.

[Mr. Linsky]

Mister Cooper,

Firstly, let me take this oppotunity to welcome you to BusTalkIII - always nice to see a new member join the ranks.

Now to business;

If you could find an original Green Line stockholder it would be a good trick because, by my reckoning, he would have to be at least 107 years old!

I arrive at that minimum age by figuring that he was a part of the original incorporation in 1925 with the average investor being about 25 years old at the time.

The bylaws of the corporation dictated that once a stockholder died, the shares had to be bought back by the company (this is part of the reason why the other Mr. Cooper wound up as almost sole owner).

However, there was one exception to the rule and that was if an heir worked for the company (which really didn't happen).

At the time I worked for Green Line in the late fifties there were no father son teams or sons of deceased stockholders in any capacity to my knowledge.

If you do know a 107 year old stockholder, I probably know him too - I knew them all!

Again, welcome to the club.

Mr. Linsky
"The Green Hornet"
Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica & Arverne, NY

[Mr RT]

Mr Burke was politically connected & a avid golfer too.
Need I say more ?

[Mr. Cooper]

Mr. Linsky,

Thank you for the welcome. Next, does the last name Succa mean anything? And I still know someone else as well.


Mr RT,

Nice of you to admit then that QS got pulled out of the hole due to favoritism. While your at it, why not also admit the Burke family took the money and ran when NYC pushed the takeover by MTAB. If I remember correctly, the "Cooper Companies" led the fight against a takeover and fought to the end, thus being the last companies taken over.

Oh, and in case you should say Liberty Lines was the first to go, they still run Westchester Bee-Line, they only lost a part of there business, but you should know that.

[Mr. Linsky]

Mr. Cooper,

Thanks for your response;

I certainly know the name John Succa and, if my memory serves, I met him more than once at the garage - but he became involved with Triboro early on (1946) as its president, and was really out of the picture (at least in my mind).

My personal relationship with the company ended after my last summer relief season in 1961 - so we're talking almost fifty years ago and that's a lot of water under the bridge!

My father continued as both an investor (not the same as a stockholder) and company compensation surgeon until his death in the late sixties, and our family relationship with the Coopers drifted apart after that because they were tied together on my father's side.

So, if there are any stockholders left, other than the Cooper and Succa families obviously, I would have no knowledge of them.

This is why my comprehensive history and personal recollections of the company end at that time.

Mr. Linsky
"The Green Hornet"
Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica & Arverne, NY

[Mr RT]

"Nice of you to admit then that QS got pulled out of the hole due to favoritism. While your at it, why not also admit the Burke family took the money and ran when NYC pushed the takeover by MTAB."

Each of the principals of the "priivates" did very well !
Some are S-T-I-L-L renting depots to them at a very good price.

"If I remember correctly, the "Cooper Companies" led the fight against a takeover and fought to the end, thus being the last companies taken over."

Mr. Cooper what ever happened to your memory ?
That's NOT why they twisted the arm of their employees & used that money to hire an attorney ... BTW wasn't that lawyer part of the family ?
There is a person at La Guardia that was fired by the Mr. Cooper for speaking his mind about the takeover & had to sue to get his job back.
Mr. Cooper how quickly you seem to forget the details

[Mr. Linsky]

Mr. RT and Mr. C,

Forgive me for eavesdropping on your conversation but I would like to set the record straight regarding a remark made by Mr. RT;

Burton Cooper, son of Bill Cooper, was general counsel to Green Bus Lines for many years.

However, he died on April 15th. 1997 long before the battle between Green Line and the city takeover plan really heated up.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9A07E7DD133FF934A25757C0A961958260

Therefore, I would look toward other solicitors as engineers of that scenario!

Mr. Linsky
"The Green Hornet"
Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica & Arverne, NY

186

[GBL Rebel]

Mr. RT-- What do you mean by this--

Mr. Cooper what ever happened to your memory ?
That's NOT why they twisted the arm of their employees & used that money to hire an attorney ...

I don't remember having my arm twisted at work. Now I wonder if your talking about the 13C issue with the non-union employees which left family of mine in the air if they had a job and thats why a law suit was brought-- or so I was told. And I can think of other transit garages where your description "a dirty dump" would apply better then JFK. As far as you saying maintance and service suffered-- That suffered because we only had 230 buses. The report DOT got from a study they had done said GBL should have 267 buses on the road during peek times. Speaking of this report I think Q65A posted about it on here or BTN.

BTW-- Petabread, your right they don't paint in the garage anymore. The paint booth was turned to warehouse storage years ago.

What I DO KNOW is-- I leave my computer a few days to go get a real Philly Cheese Steak and all hell breaks loose!!

[Q65A]

I can tell you from personal experience that the folks at GBL and JBI were very kind to me when I had written to them some years ago, requesting maps and uniform patches. I could tell by the responses that I received that there definitely was a lot of pride at GBL and JBI. (Some of the other PBL's that I had contacted were not nearly as accomodating.) Loking at JFK Depot's website (www.mtabusjfk.com) there still is a lot of pride in that facility (I'm not yet aware of any other ex-PBL-turned-MTAB websites).

[Mr. Linsky]

Bob,

Glad to see that somebody is minding the store! - pretty quiet lately.

Interesting that you say that the people at Green Line were so gracious and responsive to your requests.

When I first endeavored to write of the many aspects of pre 1960 Green Line history at www.oldkewgardens.com some years ago, I had no difficulty in obtaining both photos (as seen in my gallery) and the statistical information I needed to compliment my work.

In fact, even before they knew of my previous connection to the company, they were more than eager to help, and genuinely excited to see my galley proofs.

There was a great deal of pride in Green Line when I worked there, and apparently it has carried forward even through the dark and dismal years that preceeded the takeover.

I've seen the MTA/JFK website and it gives me a thrill to know that that sense of pride has not changed - only the color of the buses has changed!

Just a little nostalgia below - compliments of Green Bus Lines.

Mr. Linsky
"The Green Hornet"
Operator with Pride! Green Bus Lines, Inc.
Jamaica & Arverne, New York

274

[GBL Rebel]

Mr. Linsky and Q65A--

The men and women of GBL remember where we came from. We know were no better than anybody else. That has also determined how nice we are to someone- EXAMPLE-- from another pbl, you get treated nice -- from NYCT or forgot where you came from, treated not as nice.

I have found some are just trying to make a name for themself, and there kindness just means a knife in the back later. I know a few GBL guys who I swear repainted there house MTA Blue. My color is still GREEN!!!

[Mr. Linsky]

I might have spoken too soon when, in an earlier peice, I said that the Green Line Rockaway Boulevard Garage would probably stand another 55 years.

By the look of the wall pictured below, that estimate could come into question!

However, as a builder, I can tell you that the evidently patched cracks in the brickwork radiating from the doorway don't necessary mean immnent collapse but do take on the same characteristics that we see above masonary openings here in earthquake prone California.

Not to worry! GBL's home isn't going anywhere and these fissures have been caused by normal settlement - not unexpected when building in marshy areas such as was the case here.

Photo borrowed from BusTalkIII Gallery for educational purposes only.

Mr. Linsky
"The Green Hornet"
Green Bus Lines, Inc., Jamaica, NY

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