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Greyhound Lines getting away from long-haul services

 
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traildriver




Joined: 26 Mar 2011
Posts: 863
Location: Queens, NY

PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 10:31 am    Post subject: Greyhound Lines getting away from long-haul services Reply with quote

I have been studying the Greyhound system timetable for the last few years and it really disturbs me how Greyhound is abandoning wholesale many important mainline routes --even transcontinental ones.
The way its going, Greyhound may be reduced to a disjointed collection of hub and spoke operations, rather than a cohesive national network as it has historically been.

Pioneers such as Carl Wickman, Orville Cesar, Buck Travis, et. al. must be turning in their graves at the sad state of affairs of their hard work withering away......
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RailBus63
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is no different than what has transpired in the U.S. airline market. There are still transcontinental flights available between major markets, but the vast majority of air passengers must transfer between flights at least once to complete their journey. I would also suspect that the greater availability of discounted airlines such as Southwest and JetBlue has taken away much of the long-haul market from buses and Amtrak.
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Mr. Linsky
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 5071
Location: BRENTWOOD, CA. - WOODMERE, N.Y.

PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 12:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's even getting worse now because the major airlines are concentrating their efforts only on well paying routes (and how much they intend to charge us for the use of the rest rooms!).

While rural America will suffer from the lack of air connections, it may be a windfall for Greyhound and the parlor coach industry in general, so it can't all be bad!

Regards,

Mr. 'L'
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HwyHaulier




Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 932
Location: Harford County, MD

PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr 'L' -

Guess you saw the release - thru this past week - whereby DELTA wants to bail out of twenty-four (24), low volume airports.
Saw a note where many are NORTHWEST heritage service points. The firm states an operating difficulty in the cases which
would otherwise command a turboprop aircraft, riders don't want them, and insist on pure "jet" transports.

Can't imagine what we have for airline users these days! I must say I was partial to the later, "tricked up" CONVAIR aircraft,
with turboprop power plants. Often, it was a forty-four (44) seat config. FRONTIER protected much service with them...

About GREYHOUND: We can imagine the longer haul ridership has simply collapsed, and much of the ridership now on SWA.
Besides, "transcon" pool equipment can be a needless aggravation...

.......................Vern.....................
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traildriver




Joined: 26 Mar 2011
Posts: 863
Location: Queens, NY

PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RailBus63 wrote:
This is no different than what has transpired in the U.S. airline market. There are still transcontinental flights available between major markets, but the vast majority of air passengers must transfer between flights at least once to complete their journey. I would also suspect that the greater availability of discounted airlines such as Southwest and JetBlue has taken away much of the long-haul market from buses and Amtrak.


This is different than the airlines. The airlines have indeed gone mostly from point-to-point operations to hub and spoke, true; but in Greyhounds case they are abandoning entire markets, not just converting to hub and spoke. It is not feasible for buses to serve far away points in a hub operation, not further than say 300 or 400 miles.

I will agree that the low cost airlines have taken most of the long haul business away.
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traildriver




Joined: 26 Mar 2011
Posts: 863
Location: Queens, NY

PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 6:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr. Linsky wrote:
It's even getting worse now because the major airlines are concentrating their efforts only on well paying routes (and how much they intend to charge us for the use of the rest rooms!).

While rural America will suffer from the lack of air connections, it may be a windfall for Greyhound and the parlor coach industry in general, so it can't all be bad!

Regards,

Mr. 'L'


Perhaps a windfall, but I don't believe many folks losing their local air services would turn to the bus as an alternative. More likely driving to the next nearest airport with service....
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traildriver




Joined: 26 Mar 2011
Posts: 863
Location: Queens, NY

PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HwyHaulier wrote:
Mr 'L' -

Guess you saw the release - thru this past week - whereby DELTA wants to bail out of twenty-four (24), low volume airports.
Saw a note where many are NORTHWEST heritage service points. The firm states an operating difficulty in the cases which
would otherwise command a turboprop aircraft, riders don't want them, and insist on pure "jet" transports.

Can't imagine what we have for airline users these days! I must say I was partial to the later, "tricked up" CONVAIR aircraft,
with turboprop power plants. Often, it was a forty-four (44) seat config. FRONTIER protected much service with them...

About GREYHOUND: We can imagine the longer haul ridership has simply collapsed, and much of the ridership now on SWA.
Besides, "transcon" pool equipment can be a needless aggravation...

.......................Vern.....................


I loved flying on those Frontier Convair 580's with their big Allison '501' turboprop engines. In the 1970's United still had a local route between Salt Lake City and Reno that stopped in Elko and Ely, Nevada. United no longer owned an aircraft capable of that route, and contracted with Frontier to operate that flight in their behalf

Back to Greyhound....Indeed, looking at the recent Greyhound timetable, I don't see a single thru bus from coast to coast on any remaining routes.
At least one change is required.
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HwyHaulier




Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 932
Location: Harford County, MD

PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

td' -

Oh, the "mod" CV-580 aircraft were quite capable, and a good bit of fun. I also rode one,
TOPEKA - KANSAS CITY. A little story goes with it...

BTW. The run you noted covered SLC - SFO, with intermediates as stated...

GREYHOUND? Indeed! I'm seeing that, too. Under present day equipment use plans, one
wouldn't want the local domiciled equipment running far from home...

.......................Vern.....................
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traildriver




Joined: 26 Mar 2011
Posts: 863
Location: Queens, NY

PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The longest runs are St. Louis to Los Angeles, Memphis to Los Angeles, New York to Denver, Miami to Dallas, Richmond to Dallas, Denver to San Francisco, and Denver to Portland.

I agree that there are miniscule passengers today that will go coast-to-coast by bus without a stopover enroute, but it seems sad that what we once took for granted is no longer there. Used to love seeing 'exotic' destinations to all points leaving straight thru from New York City.
Indeed, it was considered at one time 'prestigious' to have coast-to-coast 'thruliners'.
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timecruncher



Age: 66
Joined: 23 Dec 2008
Posts: 456
Location: Louisville, Kentucky

PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 7:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guarantee that Greyhound has evaluated the long-haul market for viability and is following a more prudent business plan.

Several longer-distance through routes were mentioned in a previous post, but the north-south routes between Chicago, Detroit, Cleveland and Florida points are still holding up fairly well too. The big [and relatively new] terminals in Cincinnati and Louisville still host a fairly decent schedule north and south, with absolutely nothing operating east and west. Lakefront Trailways has stepped in with some service east to Athens, OH and down here in Louisville, Miller Trailways is running one round-trip daily west to Evansville over what can only be described as a bizarre route that takes five hours to cover a distance easily traveled by car in just over two hours.

I don't know about Lakefront's service in Ohio, but Miller is being subsidized by the state of Indiana for their Hoosier Ride service, which is a hodge-podge of former Greyhound, Indiana Motor Bus, ABC and Southeastern Trailways routes. Their schedules are available in PDF format - the only common carrier on the internet that actually shows its print schedules for the public to see:

http://www.hoosierride.com/schedules.asp

Fares are generally very high, and ridership is, understandably, low.
===============================================
I posted this under another thread about Western Transit, but it bears copying to this thread:

I have to wonder what Greyhound thinks is "affordable." Round-trip Louisville to Nashville (180 miles one way) is over $80.00 purchased on the internet.

By comparison, Cincinnati - Chicago on Megabus (300 miles one way) tops out at around $38.00, but can be purchased for much less depending upon how early you book.

Alas, Megabus gave up on their one round-trip to Louisville from Chicago and Indy a couple of years ago. Perhaps someday they will return...

timecruncher
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traildriver




Joined: 26 Mar 2011
Posts: 863
Location: Queens, NY

PostPosted: Tue Jul 26, 2011 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Look again. http://extranet.greyhound.com/Revsup/schedules/main.html
http://www.trailwaysny.com/html/english/fares.asp

And there are others. Smile

As for fares....I remember when all transportation companies charged simply by mileage travelled. With slightly lower though fares than adding local segments together. And some other discounted excursion fares from time to time. Then the airlines deregulated, started converting to hub and spoke operations, and started using "yield management'" to base fares on supply and demand, rather than charging for distance travelled. Its success changed the whole pricing strategy, and soon other businesses followed suit, even outside of transportation.
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timecruncher



Age: 66
Joined: 23 Dec 2008
Posts: 456
Location: Louisville, Kentucky

PostPosted: Wed Jul 27, 2011 12:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Greyhound site I knew about, but try to find it on their US or Canadian website. There is no link that I know of.

There probably is one for Greyhound Lines Canada as well, but I haven't been able to find it.

And, the New York Trailways site has point-to-point schedules, but many of them overlap, so you may ride New York to Buffalo and the bus may or may not stop in Rochester, Syracuse or other places. Trip numbers are not revealed and actual schedules showing all stops that any given trip makes are nowhere to be found that I saw.

At least Adirondack Trailways fares are competitive. Greyhound and Miller are not, nor are Lakefront Trailways in Ohio.

It is heartening to see so much bus service across New York still being run by private bus lines. Most areas of the country are bereft of intericty bus service, rail service and we've heard recently, air service as well.

I looked at the Louisville - Nashville fare again today, $71.00 web, $72.00 advance purchase, $89.00 walk up.

timecruncher
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