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30-foot New Flyer LF buses - why only one door?

 
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DE60LF




Joined: 03 Oct 2007
Posts: 142
Location: Albuquerque, NM

PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 6:08 pm    Post subject: 30-foot New Flyer LF buses - why only one door? Reply with quote

These boards have seemed very quiet recently.

I was wondering, why do New Flyer's 30-foot buses (i.e. the D30LF) only feature one door? I know that Gillig's 30-footers have two doors. I think the 30-foot Orion VII also has two doors. Most of the medium-duty buses from smaller manufacturers (such as the Optima Opus, Blue Bird Ultra LF, and Thomas/Dennis SLF200) also have two doors on their 30-foot models.

Why does New Flyer need to be the oddball here? I know that more seats can be fitted in with only one door, however, if more seats are necessary, why don't TAs just buy 35-foot buses instead?

ElDorado actually offers multiple door configurations on their Axess and EZ Rider II buses in any length. Both models in can be fitted with two doors, one front door, or one rear door. This is what makes ElDorado's buses popular with airport shuttles. Our city airport, the Albuquerque International Sunport, operates a fleet of ElDorado EZ Rider II buses with the single rear door. Santa Fe Trails up in Santa Fe, New Mexico has recently ordered ElDorado EZ Rider II CNG buses with two doors to replace their Blue Bird CSRE buses.
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Q65A



Age: 66
Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 1764
Location: Central NJ

PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NJ Transit has a fleet of 30' Nova RTS-06's running in central and southern NJ, and these have 2 doors.
Good question about the 30' NF's; perhaps this is intended as an economy move to help keep the price tag a bit lower.
I suppose that a single-door unit only would work well on lines with light ridership, or where ridership patterns tend to be predominantly one-way (i.e. like suburban and OTR coaches, which typically only have single doors).
I know that some of the smaller GM Old Looks came with one or two doors; you sometimes see single door Old Looks in historical photos in publications such as Motor Coach Age.
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RailBus63
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 1063

PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The difference with the New Flyer 30-foot bus is that it is literally a 30-foot version of their larger coaches with five or ten feet taken out of the middle. The rear high-floor section is the exact same size as the 35-foot and 40-foot coaches, so any rear door on the 30-footer would be right behind the front tire. The Gillig low-floor, on the other hand, has a proportionally smaller body than their longer models and can have the rear door further back in the bus. I'm not sure how the Orion VII 30-foot bus compares to its longer sisters.
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DE60LF




Joined: 03 Oct 2007
Posts: 142
Location: Albuquerque, NM

PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 3:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RailBus63 wrote:
The difference with the New Flyer 30-foot bus is that it is literally a 30-foot version of their larger coaches with five or ten feet taken out of the middle. The rear high-floor section is the exact same size as the 35-foot and 40-foot coaches, so any rear door on the 30-footer would be right behind the front tire. The Gillig low-floor, on the other hand, has a proportionally smaller body than their longer models and can have the rear door further back in the bus. I'm not sure how the Orion VII 30-foot bus compares to its longer sisters.


Hmm, interesting observation. I guess this is to reduce costs. New Flyer doesn't really sell very many 30-foot buses anyway; the bulk of New Flyer's sales are 40-foot and 60-foot buses. Gillig, on the other hand, is a manufacturer that largely does business with smaller transit authorities, many of which don't need larger buses and therfore sells more 30-foot and 35-foot buses than New Flyer.
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RTS_04




Joined: 26 Apr 2007
Posts: 66

PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 1:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've never seen a 30' Gillig LF with twin doors. I've seen 30' Phantoms with dual doors, but never a LF.

I think a lot of it has to do with the T-drive configuration, too. For the Nova RTS', it was easy - just pull out a few modules, and you have a bus. For a non-modular bus, especially one with T-drive, it's a bit trickier.
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RailBus63
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Joined: 16 Apr 2007
Posts: 1063

PostPosted: Sun Jun 08, 2008 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

RTS_04 wrote:
I've never seen a 30' Gillig LF with twin doors. I've seen 30' Phantoms with dual doors, but never a LF.



NFTA Gillig 30-foot low floor with rear door in Buffalo:

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tovinman




Joined: 17 Jan 2008
Posts: 24

PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2009 9:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The D30LF is simply a shuttle bus. Having a rear door would cut four seats out of it and likely negate any benefit. Having a rear door complicates the mechanicals and the heating (which is already so tight that the heater pack has to be on the roof).

It would also require considerable structure which Flyer didn't want to have to
put into it. Their point of view is that if you need a rear door, buy the D35LF.
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